Florida can’t move the finish line on removal.
A huge order came out of the 10th Circuit (Florida) in Polk County today. It’s extremely significant for anybody who is nearing the finish line and will become eligible to petition for removal under Florida Statute 943.0435(11).
Florida provides registrants only two opportunities to be removed from the State’s sex offense registry. The first applies only to Romeo and Juliet cases. The second is under 943.0435(11).
Prior to 2007, 943.0435(11) provided an opportunity to petition for relief after 20 years without subsequent arrest. In 2007, the State moved the finish line to 25 years and added a bunch of offenses that would render someone never able to petition for removal.
Today, a Circuit Court Judge ruled that the state can’t move the finish line. That alone, was a decision that is consistent with the same ruling judges in several other Florida Circuits have made, but what makes this one extra special is that the Judge expressly found the “2007 amendment to be punitive in nature”!
It’s rare and so refreshing when a Judge has the integrity to call things as they are.
A copy of the order (redacted, to avoid the petitioner the publicity he is trying to get rid of by seeking the order) can be found here
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Question…is failing to register an “offense”? If you “do nothing” or “forget”, in a sex offenders case it is a crime,but is it an offense? If you forgot to register, there really is no way it can be said you offended. You can’t offend by doing nothing. Am I right or no?
Ken
All I can say on this is there has been several stories on this site where someone has been arrested for failing to register. It says right on the paperwork that it is an offense according to the statues. I do not know where you live so I can only speak for Florida.
Read your registration paperwork to see what it says.
Failing to register is a 2nd degree felony.
I had one but it never even made it to arraignment, the county filed a no information. Never even made it to plea or anything. They didn not pursue the case at all. How is that even looked at. I was never even indicted and they dropped everything. I cant get off?
Unfortunately, the statute says that there can’t be any arrests. It doesn’t say you have to be convicted or even charged so, while I hope that someone challenges the “arrest” part of the statute, that is currently the law. That said, I was fortunate enough to fall under the 20-year rule and was blessed to find Ron Kleiner who successfully petitioned to have me removed from the “List”. I would encourage you to reach out to Ron and ask his advice. I will tell you that before we petitioned under the 20-year rule, Ron told me that if we were denied and the Court said that the 25-year rule applied, he would re-file and represent me at no additional cost for the hearing.
This depends are which part of the statue you violate. Not Every Failure to Register is a second degree felony. Most are 3rd Degree.
In Florida, all registry violations under state law are third degree felonies save one: failing to report to the sheriff within 48 hours of not leaving the state once out-of-state travel (i.e., a permanent or temporary address out of state) has been reported. Why they chose to make this a second degree felony when all other registry violations are a third degree felony is beyond me. Maybe the extra possible 10 years in prison are for inconveniencing the other state (who knows…)
Under Federal SORNA, a first violation has a punishment range of 1 to 10 years in prison, unless there are aggravating factors. If the failure to register under Federal SORNA involves the use of a firearm or commission of a violent crime, the violation carries a potential maximum of 30 years in prison. Under Federal SORNA, the registration violation must occur during the individual’s required registration period, which is 15 years for Tier I offenders or 25 years for Tier II offenders (Federal Tier III is life if the conviction was as an adult) from release, which is defined differently in Federal SORNA than in Florida state law.
Now that the Second DCA en banc in State vs. Crose has confirmed that an offender on probation is not subject to 943.0435, its time for someone who registered while on probation and has completed their sentence over 25 years ago, to ask for removal by arguing that the registration period on probation should count toward the 25 years since they registered but were not required to do so.
Pariah.001:
Your story is not unusual. You are paying for this. I am paying for this. And everyone who pays taxes is paying for this. This is why all the proregistry morons need to be educated. Let all these people that support the registry pay for it and keep all the other taxpayers out of it.
It’s good to hear that some are getting off of the registry with this law.
This law appears quite complex and I’m sure too confusing for a lot of people. Is there a possibility FAC could publish a pamphlet on this?
This is a point that motivates me and motivates other people who are not on the registry, is what we get for our tax dollars.
As long as registrants see this only as how the registry affects them, they are spinning their wheels. They can create these websites and cry on each others shoulders and hold up signs saying “the registry is unfair” and it doesn’t resonate with the public.
They need to tell people, “O.K., if you won’t let me work, I will collect food stamps, social security and welfare. I hope you pay your taxes so you can support me”. I’m tired of paying for this crap and I’m sure there are a lot of other people who are tired of paying for it too. We just need to get the word out that the registry affects them too.
Holding up signs saying “the registry is unfair” gets no traction with the general public.
Holding up signs that say, “thank you for supporting sex offenders. Keep paying your taxes” gets the point across.
Has anyone actually ever even been removed from the registry under this law in Florida?
Cherokee Jack is correct. Society doesn’t want sex offenders in their mist and create these laws to keep sex offenders off of the street and out of their neighborhoods. Out of sight and out of mind. It has nothing to do with public safety. Fifty years ago, there was a “sex offender” in just about every neighborhood who lived in peace with their neighbors. The registry only creates unnecessary drama. It’s like Fate Winslow doing LWOP for selling $20 worth of marijuana. I’m tired of paying for this.
It is good to hear from you Vicki. We are dealing with an extraordinary amount of ignorance. I’m not sure this cause has enough resources to educate the public. I believe the changes will be made in the courts and the public will eventually adjust but not in our lifetime.
Yes. Several have.
Is there any case study? Trend? A common lawyer?
Ron Kleiner has handled a number of FL registry removals.
A statistically insignificant number when compared to the total number of those listed on the registry.
Hello people, I’m now 58 yea old as dirt now and I’ve been registering for 30 years. I used to study the Florida Laws on sex offenses since 1993. Now I hit 30 years of it and I’ve yet to know of anyone to get removed. I’m sure someone out their has. You got to have your ducks in line I guess. I’ve got 4 priors 3 avg batteries and a att murder 1986,87,89 charges. Then a sex offense 1993 Tampa Fl. A bad boy I was. Got married and tightened up. But with all this I’d rather have the 4 violent charges than the S.O. Charge. In 1990 DCF was pushing legislation and because they were paying for teen pregnancy millions and millions of dollars. Guys in their 20s and girls under 18 they were sick of it and so the wheel was set in motion they couldn’t get the girls to listen so they went after the guys who should leave the hail bait alone. Run run run. So they best way to do that was shame and humiliate. Still don’t know if that worked. I still see it all over tv. I am gonna give this a try soon and try to get off the registry and I don’t need a lawyer taking 5-10 thousand dollars to do something we can do. The law is the law. I’m searching some case law on the “ just a arrest “ being even constitutional. Unless your on probation or parole which limits your rights I believe someone needs to challenge that and I see no one has at least not in Florida. Even a probationers arrest alone doesn’t constitute a violation of probation it’s called preponderance of the evidence standard. You all get what I’m saying. The only reason they continue to use the arrest no one seems to want to challenge the constitutionality of it. I havent been concerned enough to challenge it but just in the last few days I’ve been researching for the first time in years I see it’s bullshit words to intimidate and keep you on the registry. Anyway take the copy of the petition I saw here and fill in the blanks and do some research. You don’t need a lawyer when your entitled to a simple petition. Stare your case and the facts.
I have a couple typos in previous msg but you can figure it out.
Kevin
No matter how many times I proof read my posts, I always end up with a typo or two. Starting to think the auto correct is alive and messes with us.
In a court room, a typo can be the difference between going free and serving a life sentence.
Hello, I have read re-read and studied the plaintiffs petition and ruled on by the the circuit Judge Larry Helms in Bartow Fl. The plaintiff filed a petition on the 9th day of sept 2019 and on the 23rd day of Nov 2020 plaintiff was denied removal from the Fla sex offender registration requirement to have to continue this registration although the Judge stated is punitive in nature. According to the judge continued registration wasn’t do to one element ( the arrest alone ) I see that his ruling was based on the fact that he was sentenced and that sentence was the fine itself. A sentence doesn’t necessarily have to be incarceration but can include a fine or other judgements set forth by the judge for that case. As on page 2 of that order as stated “Defendants 2002 (sentencing)for the battery , however renders him statutorily ineligible to petition for removal from the registry at this time”. Nowhere in the circuit Judges speech did he base this denial on an arrest in and of itself. I have always questioned the legality of any court basing any judgement based solely upon an arrest. Many people can be in the wrong place at the wrong time or found not guilty etc. So unless my volume of BLACKS LAW DICTIONARY is wrong. I think not!The surface of being arrested is vague to the common eye and their should be lawyers out here that can see that it’s more than just being arrested that would disqualify anyone from relief based on a arrest on its face. It’s unfortunate that the petitioner in the arrest of a 2001 unrelated case had to accept the fine and probably admission of a no contest in exchange for a fine which is civil in nature. Otherwise I believe the argument would be entirely different as well as the outcome. If anyone out their has anything to add to my comment feel free to do so as their is case law and controlling case law plus I can provide statutes US STATUTUES and Florida law that shows arrest alone isn’t enough and arrest alone can not be used to make a determination by the state or a judge to deny any relief to any petitioner for any motion or any relief. Their must be a second element and that, that element must show by the preponderance of the evidence standard that a crime had been committed. My point is if you were charged since your being released from custody care and or control yet you were arrested for a baseless crime for which was dropped dismissed or found not guilty then take it to court, as long as you meet the 20 year registration timeline and your charge was before oct 1 2007 and 25 years if your charge was on or after said date. You don’t need a lawyer because you can take the facts of law with you. It’s a simple process that they make seem difficult. You only need to state two things do you meet the 20 or 25 year timeline and second did your arrest within those timelines result in a conviction? I wouldn’t go in their with a second nasty sex charge that was thrown out because you have a serious problem and in that case I have nothing to say to those looking for relief of any type. I’m speaking to a certain class that screwed up in their 20s with jail bait but didn’t fall into the 4 year Romio and Juliet law. Have a great day.
2 questions…
1. If you have exceeded the 20 or even 25 year offense free time can you be removed from the registry if you move to FL.
Is FL a “risk assessed” state or a “offense” based state. I live in another state and I am Tier 3 by virtue of the offense, not by risk.
Answer to question 1: It depends on whether you are still required to register in the state of conviction and what your original offense was. If you are still required to register in the other state, you will be required to register in Florida. Also, if your offense was similar to Florida offenses that do not permit removal, then the answer is no. Also, if you are classified as a “sexual predator” under the laws of Florida or the laws of another state, the answer is again no. However, if you are no longer required to register in your state of conviction, are not designated a “sexual predator,” did not commit a “more serious offense” (for lack of a better term) that prevents removal in Florida, have not been arrested since release, and at least 25 years have passed since release (which in Florida means the end of probation or any form of supervision if it followed incarceration), then the answer is maybe. If you’re in the “maybe” category, consult a lawyer as the law is about to change for those with out-of-state offenses.
Answer to question 2: No. Florida does have tiers per se. However, in practice there are (sort of) three levels of registration. Those designated as “sexual predators” must register every 3 months for life. Those designated as sexual offenders who committed a “more serious offense” (again, for lack of a better term) must also register every 3 months for life. However, persons designated as “sexual predators” are subject to some restrictions and burdens that “sexual offenders” are not. Finally, those who have a single conviction for a “less serious offense” must register every six months for life, but this is the group that has the possibility of removal once 25 years have passed from release provided they have not been arrested for a misdemeanor of felony offense since release. Florida does not use a risk-based system; everything is based on the offense or offenses of which the person was convicted.