10-year-old student may face battery charge after hugging school counselor
A 10-year-old boy was suspended from his Florida elementary school and faces a charge of misdemeanor battery after he was accused of inappropriately touching a school counselor during a hug, an allegation his family denies.
The counselor at Holly Hill School in Volusia County alleged that she was visiting a classroom on Oct. 24 to discuss something when the fourth-grader approached her for a hug, according to a police report and a copy of his suspension letter provided by attorneys for the boy’s family. She said she “turned sideways to give a side hug,” the letter says, and the child put one arm around her shoulder and with the other hand “reached and grabbed her left breast.” The counselor said she removed his hand and he walked away, the letter says.
The child’s family disputes the counselor’s version of events. Attorney Rawsi Williams said the boy says it was the counselor who initiated the hug. “All he did was go up to hug her. It was nothing more than that for him. He then went back to his desk, talked with his other football playmates,” she said.“The next thing he knew, the teacher calls him up and accuses him of having groped this lady. [The child] denied it, but even with him denying it, they still suspended him. They still called the police on him. The [counselor] still told the police that she wanted to pursue criminal battery charges against this 10-year-old kid.”
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Since this topic is attracting numerous comments, an update:
https://www.daytonatimes.com/community/education/family-of-boy-charged-with-cupping-school-worker-s-breast-plans-to-sue/article_50d828a8-6741-11ed-b49e-7bfeb800d8b1.html
Sounds like a 4th-degree sexual assault to me (grabbing of breasts) !
Is it just me, or is it inappropriate to question a 10 year old, get the police involved, pass judgement on the kid, suspend him, and have someone there trying to file charges against a ten year old for sexual assault-without having a parent of the minor present? They didn’t even call his parents! They just sent a note home with him………seriously?!
People please re; read the article !!
I don’t think anyone has a problem with her reporting the incident , however it also says SHE Said SHE wants to press charges against this kid . so SHE wants to see his life ruined ? That’s my issue with this not to mention its a he said she said situation , they say nothing about if there were any witnesses. Why was this counselor visiting the class room ? It says she removed his hand and he walked away. sounds like he didn’t think he did anything wrong or was I’m any kind of trouble. Then he was back at his desk talking to his friends when the TEACHER called him up to her desk and accused him.it sounds as there was no immediate out cry on the counselors part
They did actually in the new article. There was another teacher present but she said she didn’t see the encounter take place.
This case shows all the politicians and media fear mongering is working , the sheep of america are ready to believe any and every male that touches , bumps or looks at them must have deviant intentions , even a child of 10. Welcome to the new world
There is a huge self-contradiction within our legal system regarding children and sexual behavior.
On the one hand the system says children the age of this poor little boy are too intellectually and emotionally immature to give INFORMED consent to sexual contact of any kind. I agree with this view 100%.
But then on the other hand, when a child that age does anything an ADULT INTERPRETS AS INTENTIONAL SEXUAL MISCONDUCT, they suddenly have a level of culpability to be charged criminally and have their lives either destroyed outright or grotesquely altered before they even really start life.
For the longest time, there has been an insidious war waged against little boys in this country and it is beyond shameful. Too many male-hating ultra-feminists have shaped the narrative that male sexual deviance starts before said little boys even understand what sex is and what it’s all about. Some women complain men are not tender and emotional enough; not nurturing enough, but when a little boy shows genuine, pure affection and makes an honest mistake by not paying attention to where his hands are, the women then set out to utterly destroy the child in the exact manner this school counselor is doing.
What better way for ultra-feminists to pursue their agenda of destroying all male authority than to criminalize the male while he is still a child so that he grows up with no rights to speak of whatsoever?
I may be wrong, but I sincerely believe that if the child had been a little girl, nothing would have ever been said or if anything was said, it would have just been a reprimand to watch where she put her hands.
OK, I have been reading this story in the news, Florida Action Committee, Acsol, etc., and I have a few points, and opinions, about this situation.
1. Many people have been vilifying the school counselor for reporting the incident. But what else could she have done? If she had stayed silent, then word would have eventually got out that her breast was touched by a student, and she didn’t do anything about it. Some would then imply that she wanted him to do it, and others would jump to the conclusion that she has done it in the past. Thus, painting her as a child molesting school counselor. I am sure that in her state she is required by law to report any sexual impropriety that she observes…and this time that included herself. Also, what if she had witnessed this same boy touch another teacher’s breast, or that of one of his fellow students? Should she have just remained silent in those situations? Of course not. She filed the report because she is absolutely required to do so by the state. Imagine if she was actually a male and the same thing happened but with a female student that touched his crotch. If that were the case, then that male counselor absolutely should report it to save his own skin. In my opinion, she filed the report to save herself from being falsely accused at a later time for covering it up.
2. The fact that this ten-year-old boy might face charges is ludicrous. That is unless Florida is lowering its age of consent. Let me explain. Let’s assume that he will be charged by the DA. This child is then being viewed as a person that is responsible for his sexual behavior and actions. He is receiving the same course of action as he would if he were a grown man. Basically, he touched a woman’s breast without permission. That indeed is sexual assault throughout the country. However, Florida would now be looking at this ten-year-old boy as the perpetrator, not the victim, and they throw the book at him. But let’s turn the tables. What if next week that exact same ten-year-old went to counseling again, and at the end of the session he asked the female counselor if he could touch her breast. If she allowed him, should SHE be arrested for sexual assault of a minor (or whatever it is called in Florida)? Well, the state has already made up its mind regarding treating the ten-year-old as being responsible for his actions. So, in the hypothetical situation, how could the state then reverse its opinion of that same ten-year old’s ability to know right from wrong? He touches a breast without permission, and he is a perpetrator, he touches a breast with permission and he is suddenly a victim?
3. For all the people saying the counselor was wrong to report him, look at it this way… What if this happened five times a year, with different students each time, in that school district and the teachers, counselors, principals, etc. never reported any of these incidents over the past ten years. That is fifty incidents that went unreported. What would happen to those school faculties if, years later, it was discovered that 50 ten-year-olds had touched the breasts of their teachers/counselors over the past decade? What would the DA be saying and doing? Would he be finding those students, some of whom are not adults, and throwing the book at them for sexual assault? I doubt it. Instead, I think there would likely be an investigation as to why all this “sexual activities” were happening in this school district, and it never got reported. For those reasons I think that the counselor was right in making the report. She had no choice. Sweeping it under the rug would have only made HER look bad, and she seemed to have not done anything wrong.
4. So, this brings me to my last point. Did the ten-year-old do anything wrong? Yes. Should he have charges filed against him? No. What should happen to him? Short suspension and that’s it, at the most. What should happen to the counselor? Nothing, other than making sure that she never counsels this kid again, never hug a child again, etc. She needs to become hypersensitive anytime she is with a child. She came within a whisker of being accused herself of the sexual assault. It could have come down to a “he said/she said” scenario and who usually gets believed in those situations? The child.
The bottom line is this, as PFRs, we are always “walking on eggshells” and needing to be aware of our surroundings and situations so as not to give anyone any reason to think we are doing something wrong. So, I think that anyone living on the registry would actually be glad and supportive that this counselor took the steps immediately to ensure that she would not get accused of something that could have very, very easily gone the other way and changed her life forever.
Mig:
You’re entitled to your opinion, but there are way too many what-ifs, might-haves, and maybes in your scenarios. All of them failing to address the most likely – it was a simple accidental brush.
Going by the story, the counselor reported the incident out of anger, not fear. The idea that she may eventually be considered a child molester is a product of your imagination, not hers. There’s no indication that anything of that sort ever crossed her mind. Ditto, your assessment that this kid and all other students at this school will become serial molesters without police intervention. Many of the restrictions and obligations imposed on registrants that we oppose are the products of the same thought patterns, phantasms, and predictions that defy logic.
If I’ve learned nothing else as a registrant over the last few years, it’s that appeasing the insanity of registry proponents not only accomplishes nothing, it actually diminishes efforts to abolish the registry. The elimination of sexual abuse – an admirable goal shared by all – is a difficult enough to attain. It will be impossible when criminalizing accidental conduct like this, particularly when conducted by someone so young, under the logic that it would produce outcomes that are about as likely as finding Amelia Earhart.
Chew the kid out. Maybe in front of his friends if believing he was put up to it by them or was showing out. Make him clap a few erasers (or whatever the modern equivalent is). Put a note in his file in case there’s a repeat. If he did it again after all that, then have a cop put a scare into him. And if these accidents keep repeating, then take drastic action.
But pressing full charges in this instance is absolutely insane and indicative of a person that lacks the patience and temperament to be an elementary school janitor, let alone counselor or teacher. A person that hypersensitive would be better suited to a work-from-home job, as would most of society.
It doesn’t sound like it was an “accidental brush” by the fact that her breast was grabbed AND she had to remove his hand.
“She said she “turned sideways to give a side hug,” the letter says, and the child put one arm around her shoulder and with the other hand “reached and grabbed her left breast.” The counselor said she removed his hand and he walked away, the letter says.”
I cannot find in any of the news stories where she did this out of anger. Matter of fact, the only indication of motive in any of the news stories is by the boy’s family in which they are implying racism.
What would the headline read if she did not report the incident? “School Counselor’s Breast Grabbed In Front Of Class and She Does Nothing”.
First, there wouldn’t have been a story or headline if the incident weren’t reported to LE.
Second, no one ever said to do nothing, myself included.
Third, we can debate all day whether it was accidental or not, but that would be pointless. In the end, the issue is whether or not the counselor overreacted and law enforcement involvement was warranted. I still argue she did.
The end result of hypersensitivity is always either anger or fear. Hard to believe that this woman was left terrorized and permanently emotionally scarred from this incident, deliberate or not. That leaves anger to account for her response. Either way, I remain convinced that she and society would be better served to a work from home job.
You keep making assumptions.
1. How do you know that that there would have not been a story is she had not reported the incident?
2. How do you know that “no one” ever said do nothing?
3. Why is it “pointless” to debate whether the incident was pointless?
I disagree with you that the issue is whether or not the counselor over reacted… the issue is whether or not the boy grabbed her breast intentionally or not. If the counselor was frantic or screaming or calm or showing any other form of emotion, it does not add to, nor take away from the issue. In this case, look at the facts. Don’t look at the emotions. Facts do not care about feelings.
You use hyperbole statements to justify your opinion. Is it an absolute fact that “The end result of hypersensitivity is always either anger or fear”, or did you just say that in attempt to state your opinion as fact without any true evidence proving that statement? Is there not a single situation in history where there is any other result of hypersensitivity? How about worry? Perhaps that could be an end result of hypersensitivity. Did you think that this counselor is worried about what would happen to her if she did not make the report?
You imply that “this woman was left terrorized and permanently emotionally scarred from this incident”. Where do you get that idea?
Where in any report or news story does it describe her as angry? I cannot find a single story describing her emotions.
The counselor claims her breast was grabbed and she reported it.
I think it would be wrong for her career to end because a ten year old boy did something wrong to her, and it would also be wrong for the ten year old boy’s future to be negatively affected if he didn’t do it.
All that being said, how many times have there been stories on sites like this one, ACSOL, NARSOL, etc. about an adult being accused of something by a minor, the adult denying it, the adult being prosecuted, and the adult ending up on the registry?
If there was ever a story in which those of us forced to register would sympathize with the adult, I think it would be this one.
I think we should rally around her and thank her for standing up to the notion that a child can “do no wrong” and making the report.
I see hypersensitivity coming from you regarding you being convinced that the counselor did this out of anger and that she should work from home. She didn’t grab a body part, the boy did. She didn’t, by every account, freak out… she reported it.
Again, facts don’t care about your feelings.
The fact is, none of us were there so we really do not know what happened. For privacy, most school do not allow cameras in classrooms. With no other real witnesses, it comes down to “He said, she said”.
Working around kids is always going to be a risk and many teachers have started to retire or quit. Between school shootings, accusations made by kids or being blamed for your students failing, it takes a really dedicated person to be a teacher these days. And don’t even get me started on being a school bus driver and what they have to put up with.
And yes, sometimes the teachers are the problem so not throwing it all on the students. It is hard to judge sitting at our computer based on the evidence from both sides blaming the other. When I worked in Homicide, if there were no witnesses, we only had one side of the story, and that is only if we had a suspect, and if we got them to talk.
Cherokee Jack,
Well said, as always.
Those working with children do indeed put themselves at risk in many ways. I think it would be safer to always lean toward being too cautious than not. In this case, the counselor made the report and has not said another word about it. She seems to have followed the protocol required by law. If her reporting the incident was wrong, or illegal, or immoral, or unethical (as many people have implied), I would like to know why. Would law enforcement ever tell a teacher to NOT report a student touching a teacher’s breast? Would a school board instruct teachers and counselors that it is NOT a form of assault when ten year old boys touch their breasts? If that is the case, then let’s just line up the boys and let them get a “handful” every day. That is an absurd idea, but I think it makes my point.
If ten year old boys are allowed to do it, what about eleven, twelve, thirteen, fourteen years old, etc. boys? When is it wrong? Oh, at 18. Then they are an adult. Then it is sexual assault. “But your honor, I got away with it for the past 8 years, why is it wrong now?”
It is time we stop assuming a child is never wrong.