Corey Brown, Jr. was originally sentenced to prison for five years because he failed to answer his door when his probation officer knocked at 6:50 AM.
His PO claimed she showed up at his door, called his cellphone but nobody answered, knocked very loudly but nobody answered and left a card in his door but nobody called back. Brown claimed he was home but asleep at 6:50 AM, didn’t hear his phone ring or anybody knock on his door and never found a card left in his door jam. Nevertheless, the lower court convicted him of not being at his residence and gave him years in prison!
Florida’s 2nd District Court of Appeal said no way! When the State charges a violation of community control, it must prove the violation by the greater weight of the evidence. There must be finding of a willful and substantial violation of a condition of community control.
At issue was whether the “State’s evidence that no one answered the door in response to a knock is legally sufficient to prove that Brown was not home. It is not.” The court observed that Brown could have been asleep (as many people are at 6:50 AM), in the shower, or a multitude of other reasons.
FAC NOTE: if you are not under house arrest or a probation curfew, you do not need to be home when police come to do an address verification.
Thanks to Bill Dobbs for sharing this case.
https://youtu.be/jSEiS5Ih0r8
The president signed an important EO today to keep bullying regulations from Feds away from the Sovereigns, the Americans. I keep thinking over and over we should go directly to him and complain about how past previous admins have abused gov powers. He’s been giving so many criminals second chances. Idk. This EO seems to talk about submitting such info to WH when there are any clandestine or hidden regulations where Feds knock on our doors over things Americans are confused about with regulations.
On top of that, the list provided is valuable. Thank you, FAC. We have to take every chance we’ve got!
I have not studied the Floriduh laws or statutes but I would be very, very surprised if even THAT criminal regime has attempted to force a Registered Person (RP) to do anything at all regarding in-person visits at an RP’s home, work, or anywhere else. I think such visits are USUALLY just minor nuisances but I don’t think they should EVER be allowed. Registries are not acceptable and no one should ever do anything that even suggests otherwise. So I don’t think RPs should ever allow law enforcement to get near them, especially not at home, work, or school. Don’t allow it and don’t acknowledge them. If they leave a card/sign/whatever asking you to call them, throw it away. Treat it as the nuisance that they are.
It does seem like a minor thing in most cases but LE simply should never, ever see any acceptance or endorsement of Registries. Stop worrying about being the good, compliant, wet dream, reduced-rights “$EX offender” that they love so much.
You sound like to me someone who is actually FOR the registries and trying to trick registrants into getting violated. I hate what we have to do as much as the next registered citizen but doing the right thing has kept me out of jail now since they started these damn things in 1997. The fight should be in the courts, not focused on law enforcement who cannot do anything but arrest us if we give them a reason to which you suggest.Although I understand the radical stance, that usually does not end well. Think Waco Texas and the Branch Davidians.
Agreed – our moderators try to catch and filter out comments from people who encourage others to skirt the laws. We might disagree with them, we might challenge them in courts, but we will never encourage anyone to risk a third degree felony by violating any requirement of the registry. We will also never encourage disrespecting law enforcement officers. First, they are just doing their job, and second, there’s no better way to make your situation worse than to piss them off.
If you don’t like a law, contribute to our lawsuit that challenges it (or hire an attorney to bring your own – DO NOT FILE SOMETHING PRO SE).
If someone in law enforcement does something out of line, report them to internal affairs.
Thank you FAC for the nice stance. I know some think we are just sheep doing what we are told but unlike the squeeky bird gets the worm, the squeeky offender gets a jail cell.
Surely I don’t sound like someone who supports Registries, LOL! I expect that I am more radically against them than a good 99.9% of the people who are listed on them are. Most organizations won’t even let me say what I think SHOULD be done to Registry Supporters.
Having said that, I’m not encouraging anyone to not follow any laws or even try to “skirt” the edges of them. What I am saying is that no one should EVER act like the laws are acceptable. That’s all. Do what is required by law. What is forced by law at the point of a gun. But do no more.
In the state where I live, Registered Persons (RPs) are required to go to a law enforcement (LE) agency and give them information. So that is what should be done. The criminal regime of the state where I live has NOT tried to force RPs to allow law enforcement (or any other big government employees) to visit RPs at their homes. Or at their places of work or anywhere else. They have NOT tried that illegal nonsense. Therefore, RPs simply should not allow it. It is very trivial and you don’t even have to be hateful about it.
In the state where I live you can put a wall or fence around your property and never respond to LE there. Not ever. I’ve seen LE at my home before and just say “hello” to them. I’m always polite (until they aren’t) but I won’t sign anything there. The glorious LAW does not state that I must. If they want to try to push that illegal nonsense onto RPs, then let the criminals just put it in their LAWS. That’s all.
The law in our state does say that the criminal regime will mail a certified letter to an RP and the RP must take that letter to a law enforcement agency. So RPs do that. No reason to do or allow more. There are literally no good reasons to allow LE to get near you. Certainly not to get onto your property or speak to you or your family. Have people not learned anything?
You don’t have to be rude to them. But for me personally, if I know that a person thinks Registries are okay, then I know that I don’t have to have any concern for how I treat them. I don’t have to care about them or their families. I’ll worry about good people.
Because Registries exist, people should not support law enforcement. That is a consequence of Registries and their immoral, anti-factual, anti-reality, anti-American “laws”. They should understand that clearly. Registries don’t work and they’ll cost as much as possible.
Will – in YOUR state things might be different.
Will ,Just wondering what state you in?
Of course, and they certainly will be different.
But didn’t you specifically post Floriduh’s laws regarding home, work, etc. visits from law enforcement? I did not see anything in the laws that requires a Registered Person (RP) to participate in that in any way.
Where I live, RPs are required to visit a law enforcement location and give them certain information. Prior to that, a certified letter is mailed to the RP’s home and he/she must take that with him/her. So that is all done. But, the criminal regime has NOT attempted to create a “law” that requires that an RP allow LE or any other big government employees to visit them at their home, work, school, or anywhere. They have not attempted that. And I don’t think such a law would have much of a chance to be held as legal. Can you imagine if it were?! Would that not be very much just like probation or parole? Geez.
Frankly, these criminal regimes could do a LOT to make their Registries a heck of a lot more acceptable to Americans if all RPs had zero obligations AT ALL. Not even an obligation to report anything. The criminal regimes lie all the time about how they “verify” the information, so let them collect it and verify it. An RP should have zero obligations and thus would not live under ANY threat of ANY possible arrest for ANYTHING. Would that not be so much easier, more fair, and American for everyone? Sure would. That, and creating the 100+ other big government Registries that MUST exist now.
Anyway, my point was just that Registries aren’t acceptable. People should do what they have to do and NOTHING further. Do not offer up even MORE! These criminal regimes are not even capable of operating within the law. I truly have not seen one yet that CAN!! Don’t encourage that or help them. And there is no reason to want to have them on your property or near your family. They are a danger. Personally, there is no way that I will put my spouse or children in danger like that. Especially at my own home!!
If I was going to allow them to visit me, then I’d certainly make them attempt it 5 or 10 times before they found me. I’d cost them as much time and money as possible.
There is NO reason to be nice or help anyone who thinks Registries are okay.
I can’t help but notice that the law says nothing about answering the door through a Ring doorbell camera system (that can be answered from virtually anywhere via a smartphone.) So if LE does an address verification for a RC who is not on probation but uses a Ring styled device to answer and communicate with LE, does that then satisfy the verification process?
try it I’m sure you’ll have your day in court
M, there’s no reason to be a smart ass. I dont appreciate you mocking my legitimate question. You’re not being help6with that kind of response either.
LE needs to see you and your ID in order to verify.
Jacob, thanks. That is very helpful. I appreciate your response.
Wrong, they do not require you to show an ID in order to verify residency. At least in Marion County.
Also that person was on probation, many of us are not on any paper. However, they still have to do an annual, Bi-annual or 4 times a year check ( depending on your crime(s) , and if they cannot verify your address numerous times, they can submit that to your state police for violation.
I agree it is a catch 22. My officer use to always come while I was at work. He once told me I need to be there when he came and I said come before or after I am working( I gave the times ) and he said you work with my schedule not the other way around. That did not end well for either of us as I made a complaint, he got chewed out then I started getting flyers on my door once a month which was clearly harassment.
Well the sheriff’s deputies that come to my house to check residency know if I am not at home come back and check later.
They have left phone numbers for me to call so they know I’m home but I will never call them. It is their job to come by when I’m home period.
I am not on probation and haven’t been since 2007.
They know that I know my requirements and I will not do anything over that requirement period.
Also, those same deputies know if they get out of hand and want to do more than their duties require I will call on them and let their supervisor know what kind nonsense their up to.
I am respectful to all law enforcement officers, it’s just that I won’t allow any abuse of authority.
Also, As for being home for a Verification contact, If your not on any kind of Community Control or Supervision, You don’t have to be home or wait around for a LEO to come check that you still live there, BUT, If they come by and leave a notice, You must Contact them so they can come verify that you do live there ! Also, And FAC can verify this, As long as your COMPLETELY off EVERYTHING, And not on ANY kind of Supervision, You are ALLOWED to travel ANYWHERE IN THE USA without telling ANYONE that your leaving the state !! BUT, If your MOVING out of state, THEN you must notify your Sheriff that your leaving the state.. So, Yes You can travel, Fo on Vacation, Go to a Funeral, Leave for any emergency !! As long as your NOT moving, And then you gotta follow whatever state laws are in the State your going to !!. I used to travel a LOT for work, And would be in the Sheriff’s Office EVERY WEEK ! And they Never told me that I didn’t have to notify them of ANYTHING unless I was MOVING ! Then I called FDLE and they told me I did NOT have to ! Then a year or so ago, FAC sent a email to FDLE, And they were told the same thing !!. I’ve traveled for over 3 WEEKS and had contact with several Police officers throughout the country and never had any issues !.
Remember, when your off of Probation, the only laws you need to obey is any State Statues, or local laws, non of wish will state you have to be home for the local LEO checks. Don’t let the Paranoia get to you and knowledge is power, so what I do is read and educate myself on all these laws so I know my rights.
Not if you are convicted of a sexual crime.
Hey Hookscar, can you expand on this if you know something about the law? Can you cite any cases that require us to be home?
(for the record, I have been off “paper” since 2007) When they come my place for an address check, its always around 730am. And I swear they are trying to break down my door. So far they have all been very polite and very professional; something Illinois police NEVER are. Only a couple of time was the deputy snotty when I wasn’t home. He called me and demanded to know where I was and why I wasn’t at home. Told him I was working and by the way, he was also working and he wasn’t at home either. To his credit he laughed and said “fair enough”. Once they put the card in the door. I didn’t see it for three days and when I called, boy were they mad and made all sorts of threats. I explained I don’t go in and out my front door, I use the garage as that’s where my car is. I only go through the front door when I check my mail – about twice a week. Again, they calmed down and said “fair enough”. I’ve noticed, at least so far, the OC Sheriff’s office is easy to work with. You be calm and rational, they stay professional.
“Told him I was working and by the way, he was also working and he wasn’t at home either.”
I just #1 Spit out my coffee onto the keyboard #2 fall backwards in the chair and split my head open and #3 in spite of that, cannot stop laughing.
Even if a person is on supervision, what’s to say you are home even if a TV is on and your vehicle is there, etc? The only possible defense for them is if may be if on a curfew…. but then again, even if on a curfew, what’s to say you didn’t have earphones on, were in the shower, or in the backyard, etc?
@FAC– what is the documentation saying we dont have to be home for an address verification? The detective left a note saying I had to call her back and I guess be there when she stopped by. I’m curious to see the law on that.
MJ – “You guess?” If the detective tells you you have to be there when she stops by, let us know.
There is still the lingering doubt about answering the door at all if you are off probation and community control. I know the statute reads that the local Leo will conduct verification checks but that was only if they wanted some of the federal money that the sheriff was getting. Can someone reference the statutory requirement?
What part of Florida’s statute says anything about LE conducting verification checks?
943.0435(6)
(6) County and local law enforcement agencies, in conjunction with the department, shall verify the addresses of sexual offenders who are not under the care, custody, control, or supervision of the Department of Corrections, and may verify the addresses of sexual offenders who are under the care, custody, control, or supervision of the Department of Corrections, in a manner that is consistent with the provisions of the federal Adam Walsh Child Protection and Safety Act of 2006 and any other federal standards applicable to such verification or required to be met as a condition for the receipt of federal funds by the state. Local law enforcement agencies shall report to the department any failure by a sexual offender to comply with registration requirements.
My local pd has said that for the past 4 years to my wife. I NEED to be there. Then they ask where i am and how long ive been there. Then they tell her if im
Not home they will ask the neighbors. Or occasionally they make her sign something .
The Deputy who checks on me, never gives me a hard time about being home but if I am not home, he has a construction company construct a 300 feet wide side in my front yard. Ok it is on my door but it is bright yellow and announces to anyone who sees it that I am a bad person. If we could load photos I would post it
Send the picture of the sign to [email protected]
Done check your email
Notice it says in bold YOU MUST CONTACT US
even though I am not on probation
Received – Thanks!
Hasn’t happened lately, but I have also had the bright yellow door hangars announcing they were there for sex offended address verification in Leon county . I should’ve taken a picture because they’re is a court order against community and public notification in my case.
Also, it has always been my understanding the the retroactively applied registration burden is on me but the address verification burden is on “them”. Last time it took the deputy three weeks to “catch up” with me. He finally called my cell phone and co-ordinated a time when I would be there. When he did come he was there and gone in less than a minute.
So basically you’re not allowed to have to go to the store to shop or go to the post office to buy stamps? Seems to me the state of Floriduh needs a serious class action law suit.
I have so much to say right now but I suppose it would be useless.
Citizens on the registry who are not on probation are not allowed to take pictures and send them to people either through a text, email or social media???!!!!!!
I don’t see how you got this from anything written in these comments. 🤔
There is no restriction on taking or transmitting pictures, unless someone on probation or parole is under a special condition to that effect. Where are you seeing otherwise?
That is not what I meant Sarah, I just did not know how on these stories to add a photo so they provided me the email where to send them. I think you misunderstood what I was saying. I am allowed just wasn’t sure how to post the photos LOL 🙂
PS: Don’t give the law any ideas, I heard some people are not even allowed to use a computer.
Dear MJ,
If you are not on probation, you dont have to be home for the local cops to verify your address for registration purposes.
But they will keep bugging you and hanging flyers on your door until the end of time until they catch you home. At least in my registry prison zone of doom. If after several attempts to reach you, they start knocking on neighbors doors asking if they have seen you and know your whereabouts
There seems to be a disconnect with local cops and county deputies. They dont speak to each other and my city cops are pretty forceful and intimidation if im not there. Yet im under no community control
The Sheriff must SEE you in person on your Property (address on file) , To verify that you actually live there .. They are NOT required to Come Inside or INVESTIGATE your property to Verify that you actually live there ! You, do have to be there for this, BUT you don’t have to “Wait” for them to show up ! If they leave a notice, Call them and tell them when you will be home, And then go about your business !!. Also, They (Sheriff) are not supposed to show up after hours(unless you tell them to) or before 9am, This is what a Very Cool Deputy told me ! They’re supposed to make contact during “Normal Business Hours” unless your never there during the day !! . They also can’t use their Lights or Siren to “Notify” you that their there !!. Law Enforcement tries to Scare and Intimidate you , So you gotta do your research and find out the actual Laws !! And they usually come every 3 months, But it’s now October 5th and the last time I had a visit was 5/10 !! But I’m not sweating it ! My 6 month check-in was last month so I know I’m good !
Its my local pd that comes to occasionally harass and at all hours. Literally threaten my wife with getting me i trouble and telling her i need to be home. Im under no supervision or restrictions my issue happened 1996 in ny. Federal. They tell her i need to contact my “dectetive” yet i have none nor have i ever seen one. I call dispatch and have them update their blotter for the officers that come by that i tried to call them but noone ever returns my calls. They continually make her sign some paper that i live there. When i travel i have the vcso paperwork but they say i didnt give it to them: dont they see that on their screens?
My deputy said they have to “Surprise us” and are not allowed to come when WE want them to. They do random checks and if you are not there, they do not arrange appointments but will come back at random. When I worked they would always come when I was at work and I finally had to file a complaint stating to either come before I leave or after I am home or you will never get me. I said I am willing to work with you but if you want to chase me forever have at it. Shame when those of us who try to be polite and helpful and they still give us grief. I had one officer I really liked but I guess they thought he was too lenient so they got Hitler’s grandson to start coming by