The following was sent in by a Member. If anyone had a similar experience, please share so he can work towards resolving this issue.
I retired from the Navy in Dec 2000 due to my impending legal issues. I received a full retirement, as I had already completed over 20 years of service. In June 2001 I had my day in court and my journey on the registry began.
Here in Jacksonville the Naval Hospital is located on the Naval Air Station. So every time I had a need for a service from the hospital I would show my identification card (ID) and zip onboard the Base. I have easily gone onto the Base 100 times since my retirement. Never an issue…well until today.
I arrived at the front gate of the Base about 7 am to ensure I would be early for my scheduled 745 appointment. I presented my ID and was told there is a problem, would I pull over to the area designated for “problems”. Apparently in 2011, Patrick Air Force Base in Canaveral placed a note on my account barring my entry to their base which meant I now barred from ALL military installations. After a number of Security personnel came over and asked questions, one of them made a command decision to escort me to the Hospital for my appointment; with the understanding I would get in touch with Security to figure out what flagged my ID card. I had a sneaking suspicion I knew what was going on.
A call to the Security Officer, a call to security at Patrick AFB and it was confirmed that my status as a Registered Citizen put me on a “Do not allow access” list. SOOO, since 2011, I have been gaining access to the Base ILLEGALLY. Yep, my 10 plus visits for my wife to the ER, ILLEGAL; my 30 days in the ICU, ILLEGAL; my 16 visits for inpatient/outpatient procedures, ILLEGAL; you get the idea.
As the last medical appointment was finished, I found two Security Officers waiting to escort me across the Hospital to the Security Office. Totally degrading, completely a walk of shame. Once at the Security Office, I was presented a letter on behalf of the Commanding Officer denying any access to the Base. If I attempt to gain access to ANY military installation I will be in violation of TRESPASS of a FEDERAL FACILITY/INSTALLATION. Title 18, Section 1382 empowers military commanders to prohibit certain individuals from entering on military base, or even in a region or area. A barrment is an action taken by a debarring official, usually a garrison commander, under the applicable laws and regulations to exclude a person or business from entering on a military installation or participating in contracts under the Federal Acquisition Regulation. Once a person or business is so excluded, it is considered that such person or business are debarred. https://www.avvo.com/legal-guides/ugc/how-to-appeal-a-barment-letter-from-military-base
Then, I was escorted back across the Hospital by another Security Officer to get back to the car. That Officer then followed my car off the Base.
I currently have no idea what am I supposed to do about my medical benefits that I pay an additional premium to get handled on the Base? I have lost access to my primary care DR, the Pharmacy, as well as all the other services the Hospital offered. How do I take care of getting my spouses ID card replaced later this year when it expires?
I share this experience because I know there are some others that are retired military or have access to a military installation to just beware, Barrment from one Installation will most likely result in barrment from ALL Installations.
I had a situation at Mayport installation several years back. I was a subcontractor to AT&T and I had a work order to remove some telecom batteries from a building which I previously visited 7 months prior. Upon presenting my credentials, the pass and decal lady ran my information in this new “RapidGate” program that the installations started using earlier that year. She informed me that I am unable to get a pass. I said I was just here and received a pass 7 months ago. she said ooooo, had yeah I can see you in our system and had you came back 60 days ago, you could’ve came on. So I asked what was the reason conlsidering it’s literally going to take me 15 minutes to remove them and exit the base. she said she doesnt know and gave me a number to call. I called the number and the guy said it was because my name showed up on the registry and due to the safety of their personnel and the facility, i am denied. Im likeits literally going to take 15 minutes from start to finish. he said unless i can have someone else do the job, he cannot allow me on… even with an escort. so i said ok and hung up. 2 weeks later, I received a nice little letter from the CO of the base explaining that i am banned from entering the base, the exchange (which is off base), and the Ribault housing area. Failing to comply will lead to me being detained and federally charged with trespassing. Now our company was small, it as only myself and another tech in jacksonville, and the other tech was out of state on another job so it was just me here. As a vet, i was offended to be “banned” from a base, but it was not like I was a frequent visitor of the base both while i was in and when i got out.
Chris,
Does access to the base still hold importance? There are possible avenues you can take to request a waiver. There are no guarantees but you dont ask and the answer is always NO.
Access to telecom facilities with equipment owned by AT&T on base is/was important at the time. Base utility/maintenance staff have strict instructions not to perform any maintenance, removal, or installation of the equipment (building collapse or fire is different). I never disputed anything she said nor made a big fuss on the phone about my prior visit (before the implementation of rapidgate). I just said thank you and calmly left the base. Then notified my supervisor of my denial to base access and he personally drove up to take care of the job.
I just found it funny that I received a “banned” letter from the CO of the base which was copied not only to base security but up the chain to darn near short of SECNAV. However, base access IS important to those who frequent medical facilities such as the original poster. Base security doesn’t do anything anyway (LOL) so it would not have been an issue to escort an individual to the hospital and back to the gate. Or a long shot, provide a shuttle from the main gate to there and back. But for me personally, I can care less.
An update on my Base barrment situation. I reached out to the FAC members and leadership about what occurred. ALL of the responses were heartfelt. Some of the advice could not be used, but was appreciated. I was able to obtain the Naval Instructions that provided accurate steps and points of contact on what to do and how to submit it. As of today, I have drafted a four page letter to the Navy leadership that is within the guidelines they have established. I have spoken to the Navy lawyer in charge of providing the Admiral with the information proving the waiver I am requesting is legal and valid. I have been told my request in in accordance with the instructions, properly formatted and concise. The lawyer has also indicated I can call / email anytime for a status update. I was treated with kindness and respect from the Navy representation.
In short, FAC gave me a podium to ask “Can anyone offer advice” and it worked. I am hoping to have my access to the Bases re established in about two months. Thanks again to everyone that responded.
This is great news, Al, and I hope it works out in the end.
Al, this is great news. I see that JZ helped you out below on what to do. All the legal work shows that they cannot refuse to allow you on base as long as you get the waiver. That is why I was shocked when you reported being denied access. I thought that the military had changed their policy. So glad to hear that is not the case.
We were forced to move because of Clay County’s residency restrictions, but before the move, we used NAS JAX all the time — a great place to go. And yes, I have found that the military treats registrants with the greatest of respect, as well as all of society.
One added note, when I was researching all of this before JZ sent the regulations to me, I had read that bases allowed registrants who worked for civilian contractors on the base. The only stipulation was that they had to obey the laws concerning registrants — the same as you would off base. That is why I was shocked when you said you were barred. A special thanks to JZ who always helps us out with this situation.
Your problem is that you are in Florida. Talk to the ACLU about your situation, and what you can do. You may have to sue for remedy! Good Luck! I travel around the world and have never been refused access to any base, including Homeland Security Bases!
@Big Al in Jax & FAC,
I have mentioned this same issue (which affects me) many times in my posts on this website. I have all the Navy Instructions, NAS JAX Security and Navy Region Southeast Legal Office points of contact. Rather than typing a multi-page post here, I will make this information available to FAC upon request. They can retain this information and assist retirees statewide.
What it boils down to is getting a waiver (a letter) signed by Rear Admiral Mays. He is the current Navy Region Southeast Commander. With this letter (and a day pass) you will be able to access medical, commissary, exchange, and veterans offices on any Navy base in the Southeast Region which includes NAS JAX and Mayport.
I don’t want to speak for Capt. Munsey, but I’m sure he has valuable information to share as well.
JZ. That information would be very helpful. My email is. [email protected]. I am ok with this being posted. Thx in advance. Al
Is it possible to forward my contact information directly to JZ? Having the specific instructions that support my arguement and to see clearly where the military is standing would be very helpful. Thanks
FAC, I see you mentioned you have a liaison at the VA. I’m a former veteran that has been battling the VA for years to get a disability rating and compensation, but to no avail. I know you are not a law firm, however, if you could give me this person’s name, maybe they could point me in the right direction. Thank you for you assistance!
I know folks that can help you as well, so let me know the best way to send you the POC.
BIG AL
THANK YOU FOR YOUR 20 YEARS OF SERVICE
I being Ret. disabled USAF veteran KNOW very well how you must feel inside, that blank check you wrote to this government was used several times over and tossed away.
your story has been on my mind the entire day,
I would like to say if you had a plea withhold ADJ or other type that removes the conviction after you successfully completed Probation then it is not considered as a conviction in a US court if the military claims you have a felony conviction. you dont. just a thought.
Folks, the issue here and what many of you don’t realized is that Garrison Commanders have extraordinary powers and authority and pretty much they can do whatever they want and built up policies based on ” safety first”. It won’t matter how many complaints you make through your senators or congressmen, they will deny you access to the base because access to the base is a privilege, not a right and they can do it easily every single day of the week.
Now, yes, if you live in areas where major hospitals are not available, then yes, almost every VA hospital is superior to the military medical care facility, however, if you are like, in Hawaii, San Antonio, or in a place where you have a Level 1 hospital, then yes, the military hospital is better than VA.
Another thing is that is understandable your husband frustration, he gave 20 years of his life to the service of this country, he deserves better, regardless of his current status. He earned his privilege to access the base and do whatever he wants that is within the boundaries of what is right, like playing golf if he wants it and now, he is treated like a pariah or someone who deserves to be sent to exile in the most remote region of Siberia, away from any kind of human contact, hell, even away from any kind of animal contact for what is worth, because of a crime committed long ago.
I haven’t been turn away yet, but it is a matter of time I guess when my number will be up and be turned back. I sure hope that it doesn’t happen, but reading your story, it surely looks like at some point it will….
From everything I have learned and experienced, the VA is VERY receptive to registrants. They do not differentiate between registrants and others who go to the VA. I would highly recommend the VA for you.
The bases are starting to push away retirees from the base medical facilities due to a lack of funding.
My husband is retired military, having received most of his health care from a large navy base. The VA healthcare in Gainesville is far superior to what he received at the naval base. In fact, a man who is high up in the VA command, said that the Gainesville VA is second only to Walter Reed.
Like you, my husband served two tours in a war — the Vietnam War. As a pilot, he flew every other day into combat, being shot at for a war that should never have been fought, or at least not the way the military was allowed to fight at that time. He and his fellow pilots knew that, but they still did what their orders said they must do. If this country ever decides to start breaking their promises to these men and women, then there will be no hope for the USA. So you should be fine if you have access to one of the better VA’s.
There’s a veteran in my Jacksonville SO treatment group. He feels the VA is providing him excellent care in Gainesville (and they even cover his mandatory SO treatment).
It sounds like it is time for a complaint to your senator/congressman. As a retired service member, you know the power of a complaint to one of them. As this is an election year, you might have this overturned in no time.
Good luck brother.
My brother, I can feel your pain as if it is my own. It is not fair that after you paid your dues to this country, something few would ever understand, you are treated less than a third class citizen. That being said, there is not much you can do in that respect.
Garrison commanders follow the law to the teeth and on top of it, they add few touches to ensure that they are covering their rear end, why?..because in their minds, if something, God forbids, happens due to an action on your part inside the installation, then, the IG that will be investigating (and the CID) will note that the commander had implemented a strong compliance plan, they would not be at fault for your actions and that it was you who failed to follow through.
Now, when it comes to the VA side of the house……you can get medical treatment, it will not be like in the military base, but still is medical treatment. At the beginning, it will not be free, you will be paying a small deductible for any medication you are taking and that the VA will be giving you while at the same time, you will need to submit a claim for your disabilities. Once you get a rating, then you pay nothing from that moment forward. Your wife and yourself can get medical insurance, but you have to be rated 100% Disabled Permanent and Total before she qualifies for that insurance. It will be a long uphill battle, but if you need some advice, please feel free to contact me.
I hope all this abuse derived from the registry one day is a thing of the past. I hope that we at least, will have some breathing air left enough to see that moment coming to fruition…….
VA will take care of you no matter where you are – and without charge. I got my husband enrolled in VA care prior to his prison release in 2007, and he has been well cared for there without a hitch since. Of course, this means your wife will need insurance and, at age 65, she will qualify for Medicare Advantage. Here in AZ, we have Medicare Advantage with no monthly premium and, on most policies, no copay for Primary Care Visits. My husband and I each have a new Med Advantage United Health Care policy with no copay, see any doctor, any facility, $1000 dental, specialist visits $40 copay, etc. I hope this is helpful. Husband uses this as a backup for his VA, if needed.
#1-Thank you and bless you for your service. Nothing any of us has done in a moment can take away what you have done for our country…EVER!
#2-I will pray for you, and for all of us.
#3-Get an attorney NOW.
#4-Contact the governor, contact the president. You are one of our precious few citizens who risked their life and gave up so much, along with your family. Someone has to see the injustice here. It’s horrifying. But consult with an attorney first due to the fact that you were unknowingly barred but went on base anyway. We all know that we are supposed to look at our crystal balls everyday to see what has changed that we haven’t been notified of.
#5-GOOD LUCK!
My prayers are with you.
Hi brother- I am so sorry this happened to you! I know the feeling, the shame, the mortification, it is hard to bear…especially because it is so unjust.
All I can do is offer to pray for you and trust that God has a plan for all of this. I also wonder if you should contact an attorney?
We have reached to our contact at the VA who is already on this.
She mentioned that he (or anyone in the military) can always access health services at the VA, which cannot turn persons away.
That said; we understand why he would want to continue with his primary doctor, etc. so more to come…
Our VA contact wrote, “any Veteran with a felony conviction is not allowed on base.” Likely, nobody bothered to check in the past, but in this case, someone did and you were “tagged” as ineligible to access.
Current reasons for denial of visitor access include anyone who:
• is currently on probation or parole
• is registered as a sex offender
• has a history of gang affiliation
• has an extensive criminal history
• is currently on the terrorist watch list
• has an active warrant
• is currently barred from any U.S. military base
• has a felony conviction for murder, assault, sex offenses, and other serious felonies
Read more: https://www.jobsforfelonshub.com/can-a-felon-get-on-a-military-base/#ixzz6N5IHG9tL
I shared this experience to prepare (if possible) others for the impending problems of access to any military installation. Once I removed the emotional feelings from yesterdays event a few things ring as my truths.
1) I have been made aware FORMALLY I am not allowed back onboard the facility. I will have to find other ways to replace the services I was receiving at the Naval Hospital.
2) Hiring a lawyer to contest Title 18 Section 1382 will be expensive and most likely ineffective. I am not declaring surrender, but like everyone, my finances are always not enough.
3) I am worried that if I am barred from military bases, what other federal locations are next? Will the VA? Will State and National Parks?
From the emotional perspective. Before I got into trouble back in Dec 2000 I was near the top of the enlisted ladder, leader of men, when I spoke the number of sailors who wanted to be first to answer my call was amazing. In one day that changed and I was allowed to quietly disappear and retire from the Navy without any discipline or fanfare. THAT was a blessing. Back then all the entitlements of being retired were still mine to enjoy.
I have been retired right at 20 years. I dont wear the hats that say RETIRED NAVY, I dont have any indicators on my vehicle, I dont even have a VA loan. Those things are not important to me. The walk of shame through the hospital, being escorted, brought it all back. Thankfully my head is in a much better place to cope with this.
I do wonder if, when the Ex Post Facto is found to be unconstitutional (notice the positive) will Title 18 be modified?
AND I do have a means to contest the being barred from Bases/Installations. I dont think it has a chance in hell to succeed but I will be doing my research and generating a letter to the General that initiated the barrment process.
Big Al,
We appreciate you bringing this issue to our attention, your courage in talking about it, and naturally your service to our country.
I wrote to you privately with copy to the liaison we have at the VA and assured you that the VA would take care of you. The reality is that military bases can exclude people convicted of felonies. I don’t know that this was anything personal, it is policy and it’s likely a security issue (for some types of felonies more than others)>
OUR Ex Post Facto case challenges the Florida registry, so that would impact Florida Statutes, not US Code. For purposes of AWA/SORNA you might want to find out what Federal Tier you fall under and see if you can petition for removal from the FEDERAL obligation and then somehow get yourself back on the base. Or you might want to check out the services of the VA and spend your money on a vacation and enjoying retirement.