Yesterday, a Federal District Court in Tennessee found that the Tennessee Sex Offender Registry, as applied to the Plaintiff, violates the Constitution.
The Court found; that the restrictions of SORVTA are much like traditional punishments of shaming, banishment, and probation, particularly when those restrictions are imposed for life, that the registry imposes an affirmative disability or restraint on Plaintiff, that permanence of SORVTA’s restrictions, based solely on his prior offense rather than a present potential of re-offense, weigh in favor of traditional punitive aims, among other things.
The Court concludes that the effect of lifetime compliance with SORVTA is punitive as it relates to Plaintiff. While the court made clear that this only applies to the plaintiff, the facts and circumstances are likely common to most on the Tennessee registry prior to 2004.
A copy of the decision can be found here: TN Doe v. Rausch
Question here…
I have been reading many comments and many cases because I am like many of you, want to get out of this damn registry. I know I am way, waayy out the time when I can actually petition to get of the registry because I just won my motion to get off probation. My charges were in 2012 and I did short of 8 years in probation.
I don’t have a felony conviction because the judge granted a Withhold of Adjudication. I still have to register, but I can safely state that I don’t have a felony. For what I understand, when the probation ended, the case got dropped (and again, I STILL HAVE TO REGISTER, JUST LIKE EVERYONE ELSE).
One question I have is this…. would the 25 years applies to folks like me that have the Withhold of Adjudication?…. I know I have all my civil rights and one of the options I am contemplating is to petition for clemency to the governor after 7-10 years?. If anyone here has any suggestion or experience with this motion, I would welcome the words of advice.
The statutes are not very clear to me as it relates to this withhold of adj, so whatever information can be shared to weight in futures options I will appreciate and welcome it.
Beef
I too am a strong Christian. But lawyers do not work for free nor offer guarantees. I do not have numerous $1000’s of dollars to win or lose. If it was a guaranteed win then I could pick the noses of Irish fishermen on the dock’s for a few pennies to raise money. But I have lost too many hearings and money to go with it. I have paid for my accusations a 100 times over.
The sentencing appeal took me 10 years of battles to win but was worth it because it was before a different judge who happened to be friends of my lawyer. Yes 100% fair because my sentencing judge was close friends with the prosecutor and was even seen in private discussing my case before my sentencing.
And the class actions are cool but like I said before, they usually benefit just those who are named in the suit. But maybe if they win and 1000s of us flood the courts with suits, our voices will be heard.
unless the sexual predator has had his or her civil rights restored
When you’re released from prison and parole/probation, your civil rights ARE restored. Now let’s see how they then go about contradicting themselves as a way to keep you on the registry…
However, a sexual predator who has been lawfully released from confinement, supervision, or sanction, whichever is later, for at least 10 years and has not been arrested for any felony or misdemeanor offense since release, may petition the criminal division of the circuit court for the purpose of removing the sexual predator designation
Gotta love the use of that language: “However”. They’re literally contradicting themselves and it should be brought up in a lawsuit.
ANOTHER GREAT DECISION, but this time it is out of the governor’s office in California. Gov. Gavin Newsom is proposing to significantly shrink the footprint of California’s prison system, partly because of massive budget cuts prompted by the pandemic but also because of philosophy.
The revised budget he sent to state lawmakers this week envisions closing two state prisons in the coming years; cutting nearly one in five of the 43 inmate firefighter camps; and eventually closing all three state-run juvenile prisons.
He’s also seeking unspecified increases to sentencing credits that allow inmates to leave prison more quickly. And he proposes to shorten parole to a maximum of two years, down from five years for felonies, and let ex-felons earn their way off supervision in just a year, or 18 MONTHS FOR SEX OFFENDERS.
My husband has 28 YEARS OF PROBATION.
https://krcrtv.com/news/local/governor-newsom-wants-to-shrink-california-prisons-as-a-part-of-budget-cuts
What is the governor of Florida doing? He is not willing to do anything to help registrants avoid possible contact of the virus through in-person registration. In his talks with the media, he states that a few places in Florida have recently seen a spike in virus cases, but not to worry he said. The spike is due to the increased cases in the prison population. There was no mention of how the state could help out the deplorable situations now within our prisons. It was very clear in his talk that inmates do not matter; they do not count as real people.
What a sea change in CA politics. 25 years ago, candidates there competed to show who could be more “tough on crime.” They have since learned their lesson, but in FL this will take more time.
“cutting nearly one in five of the 43 inmate firefighter camps”
That part I do not agree with. Not only does that include an essential force to help battle California’s awful fires annually, but also gives the inmates a goal and to feel useful. I do not know all the details but that part of his plan sounds bad.
I know in Florida, anyone in prison on a sex offense was not allowed to go out on work crews. I applied 3 times and was denied 3 times. Even had a Sgt. speak on my behalf and still denied. However, one guy who was allowed to go out that was no in for a sex offense, had only 6 months left on his sentence and he took off from the work crew and was caught and given an escape charge.
Roe v. Wade wasn’t won without protest and marches! They refused to recognize the civil rights movement without much protest, marches and violence, including loss of life! They didn’t stop drafting for the politician’s war, Vietnam until there were very violent protest, marches, and life lost (remember Kent State). It’s time we grow some balls and commit to the invitable. No one can do anything for us until we become a very loud roar on the battle field!!! We are all going to die one day, I’d rather die still possessing the unalienable constitutional rights God gave me then to die hiding like a coward because I might care about what someone thinks of me. It’s great that the system wants to look out for the children of today. But what about the children of yesterday who are undeniably the product of the same demise!!! It’s time for all of us to roar in the faces of our current abusers like Lauren Brook. We must make it known that we refuse to be victims anymore. We won’t be victims for Lauren Brook or John Walsh or anyone who wishes to take advantage of our fears. It’s time we shed the abuse of fear and do mean battle with the true abusers!!! We are humans, and citizens it’s time to become warrior’s. We cant just hide in shame and hope that FAC will become our “War Daddy”. It’s time to fight for our rights or just go hide in the shadows and shut up until you die. No one is going to do this for us!!!
Um, Roe v Wade was won in court. So was the victory you are responding to. They were not influenced by protests and marches, but if you are interested in going that route, you should hook up with Women Against Registry which already does this.
There seems to be a lot of confusion about durations of registration before petitions can be filed. I hope this clears things up.
FAC, feel free to add this to your “Resources” list of documents.
For “Sexual Predators:”
https://www.flsenate.gov/Laws/Statutes/1997/775.21
(g) A sexual predator must maintain registration with the department for the duration of his or her life, unless the sexual predator has had his or her civil rights restored, or has received a full pardon or has had a conviction set aside in a post-conviction proceeding for any felony sex offense that met the criteria for the sexual predator designation. However, a sexual predator who has been lawfully released from confinement, supervision, or sanction, whichever is later, for at least 10 years and has not been arrested for any felony or misdemeanor offense since release, may petition the criminal division of the circuit court for the purpose of removing the sexual predator designation.
https://www.flsenate.gov/Laws/Statutes/1998/775.21
(l)A sexual predator must maintain registration with the department for the duration of his or her life, unless the sexual predator has had his or her civil rights restored, or has received a full pardon or has had a conviction set aside in a postconviction proceeding for any felony sex offense that met the criteria for the sexual predator designation. However, a sexual predator who was designated as a sexual predator by a court before October 1, 1998, and who has been lawfully released from confinement, supervision, or sanction, whichever is later, for at least 10 years and has not been arrested for any felony or misdemeanor offense since release, may petition the criminal division of the circuit court in the circuit in which the sexual predator resides for the purpose of removing the sexual predator designation. A sexual predator who was designated a sexual predator by a court on or after
October 1, 1998, who has been lawfully released from confinement, supervision, or sanction, whichever is later, for at least 20 years, and who has not been arrested for any felony or misdemeanor offense since release may petition the criminal division of the circuit court in the circuit in which the sexual predator resides for the purpose of removing the sexual predator designation.
Duration of 20 years added by 98-81
http://laws.flrules.org/1998/81
https://www.flsenate.gov/Laws/Statutes/2005/775.21
Duration of 30 years added
https://www.flsenate.gov/Laws/Statutes/2007/775.21
Duration of life added.
For “Sexual Offenders:”
https://www.flsenate.gov/Laws/Statutes/1997/943.0435
No duration in statute.
https://www.flsenate.gov/Laws/Statutes/1998/943.0435
(11) A sexual offender must maintain registration with the department for the duration of his or her life, unless the sexual offender has had his or her civil rights restored or has received a full pardon or has had a conviction set aside in a postconviction proceeding for any felony sex offense that meets the criteria for classifying the person as a sexual offender for purposes of registration. However, a sexual offender who has been lawfully released from confinement, supervision, or sanction, whichever is later, for at least 20 years and has not been arrested for any felony or misdemeanor offense since release may petition the criminal division of the circuit court of the circuit in which the sexual offender resides for the purpose of removing the requirement for registration as a sexual offender.
Duration of life/20 years added by 98-81
http://laws.flrules.org/1998/81
https://www.flsenate.gov/Laws/Statutes/2007/943.0435
Duration of 25 years added by 2007-209
http://laws.flrules.org/2007/209
Is this something that can be challenged in court? Obviously there is a big discrepancy between “For life and then after “20-25 years” someone can petition for removal. It’s either/or not both as far as I can see. Also Big J mentioned
“Who do not comply with the requirements of offender registration laws commit a felony of the third degree, punishable as provided in s. 775.082, s. 775.083, or s. 775.084. • Must maintain registration with FDLE for the duration of their life, unless they have had their civil rights restored or have received a full pardon or have had a conviction set aside in a postconviction proceeding for any felony sex offense that meets the criteria for classifying them as a sexual offender for purposes of registration.”
This is something I remember seeing before my conviction- my issue with this it’s too broad. What is the likelihood this can the challenged if not already?
Just out of curiosity, does anyone know if Tennessee, like some other states, automatically classifies out of stators as lifetime registrants? I wouldn’t think so because they have a provision that says that a 10 year registrant from out of state have to wait for five years after they have moved to Tennessee or the original 10 years which ever is later. But it would be interesting to see when that five-year rule was put into affect and also when their general law regarding residency restrictions was passed. I think and really hope that the next area that the legal Eagles start exploring is the treatment of out-of-state registrants in some states where the law provides for removal from the registry after a reasonable time. I seem to recall that we had a case in Indiana like that recently although I don’t remember if it was a federal or state case. We have a number ofStates like Ohio and Pennsylvania were certain X post Facteau application of their laws have been struck down by their own courts, but they still treat out of stators differently. As many of you probably know, there a goodly number of states who either say you register for the amount of time our laws say or your state of conviction which ever is longer. Some others just automatically classify you as a lifetime registrant regardless of your offense. Florida is one of those states.
The Florida law says that you can petition for removal after A period of time once you have completed all sanctions. Last time I heard maybe one or two people had actually been removed. But it does raise an interesting question. If we count this most recent case where someone supposedly don’t have to be on the registry because he hasn’t completed his sentence or something like that because he hadn’t paid a fine then are we effectively saying that the state the name have to consider us for removal until 1015 or 25 years after we paid all of our phones? Isn’t that whatThey are trying to do with the voting rights registration law? Like I have said in the past sometimes these wins aren’t exactly wins
Look up Person ordered removed from Florida Sex Offender Registry that may or may not answer some of your questions about removal the problem is there aren’t enough Lawyers out there qualified to do so and those that are want a arm and a leg knowing we can’t afford it so 20 or 25 it might as well be life we ain’t got the money for it any how so just sit back watch FAC and pray for the best just saying
Just to clarify, FAC is correct, Registration has NEVER been 5 years, 10, years, etc: Please refer to the 1998 State law from FLDE: (Also I would recommend against posting information that simply is not accurate, this can and does affect people’s lives)
Who also meet all qualifying criteria for sexual offender, sexual predator, including a court finding, must register as a sexual predator as required under s.775.21. (1998, FDLE)
• Who do not comply with the requirements of offender registration laws commit a felony of the third degree, punishable as provided in s. 775.082, s. 775.083, or s. 775.084. • Must maintain registration with FDLE for the duration of their life, unless they have had their civil rights restored or have received a full pardon or have had a conviction set aside in a postconviction proceeding for any felony sex offense that meets the criteria for classifying them as a sexual offender for purposes of registration.
Big J, ur are wrong too. U didn’t have to have a court ruling. U could be subject on being on probation on Oct 1, 97 and just thrown on there out of the blue. Those are the ones that need to have their case either reopened or at least taken off the registry. Whether u wanna call it punishment or whatever, at the very least it causes severe mental anguish and is by far important enough to know ahead of time.
Not sure how they got away with applying even to those who were still in prison either. None of them got a chance to fight it as they had already been found guilty or made a plea. For example, when gain time got taken away, those who already had it like myself got to keep getting gain time. Those who were sentenced the day the ruling started and after would not longer get the previous gain time. I did about 40% of my time whereas those after me were subjected to 85%.
Imagine the riots that would have taken place if those already doing just 40% of their time got ex post facto-ed to 85% while still serving time. The 40% made even the most violent offenders re-think attacking someone as to be able to get home. 15% potential of getting out early is not much incentive to behave. On a ten year sentence you would get out in 8 1/2 years whereas on doing 40% of your sentence you would get out in 4 years, if you didn’t mess up and lose gain time.
There was one fellow in there who was a quiet older man. He kept to himself and never bothered a soul. Even the most hardened guy in there had nothing bad to say about the guy. During a raid, the guards found him with some colored highlighter markers to mark in his Bible, which for some reason was against the rules and he got a write up that cost him some of his gain time.
The point is, they ( Jerk law makers and politicians ) pick and choose which laws they want to make retroactive. Always seems to be those with sex related charges that get the trial run on legality of this BS.
Pretty sure the TBI will find some reason to keep this guy registered, and that whatever reason they come up with will be absurd. They lose SORNA dollars if too many people are removed; can’t have that.
Nonetheless, I hope he keeps at it. Appeal their decision all the way up and take it to court again if need be. A federal court would probably be ideal. Local criminal/superior court judges are elected and every bit as much politicians as the legislators that write these stupid laws. Face it, the politics of the moment swing far more discretionary opinions and rulings than fairness, justice, and search for truth ever will.
Tenn is not in compliance anyway as most folks can petition to get off the registry after 10 years or 5 years after moving to Tenn whichever is later…….in theory
In addition to the above. I just saw that the Senate has approved a bill that will allow the FBI to search you browsing history with out a warrant. And, of course, the it also says that the senators and representatives are exempt from this search. Thank you Mitch McConnell you piece of shit. Time to flush the toilet!
I am not surprised, but it actually spells that out in the bill? I need to look for that. All the…”if they can do this to Flynn imagine what they can do to you”…and I am like they do it already!! And then they vote this. And people are like…well…ya know, only for the bad guys. Ugh.
It is slowly working. It is truly sad that the power structure in this country works its own agenda and wipes its ass with the constitution. I hope with all my might that when this entire fiasco crumbles that the people responsible for it will reap their just reward and all die of cancer. I am sorry for this vitriol but that is how i feel about this. This country has a major problem with how it treats and respects everyone in it. Racism, power hungry political leaders, government paid thugs as in the police force. populous manipulating news outlets, and an us vs. them mentality throughout the land. I could go on but whats the point. You already know. Sorry for the rant. We need to mobilize our movement. When I was a war protester during the Vietnam war we had meetings on how we would disrupt the politician’s propaganda meetings and how we would protest. We had a plan and backing. The problem with us is that i believe that we as a class of persons, yes a class, have been under the jack boots of the oppressors for too long and have lost our strength, if we ever had any. How can we rise up and make a lot of noise.
Even being on the registry, wishing someone dying of cancer is pretty evil. My Dad nearly died of cancer and I would not wish that on my worst enemy.
Having said that, I would not wish the registry on my worst enemy. However, if you wished they got a taste of the registry themselves, I would have no issue with that.
A more reasonable thing though would be that they are held accountable financially for all the years we lost on the registry. Like someone falsely accused and put in prison. Even though many of us may have actually committed a crime, we did our time but were given another more harsher life sentence. The only difference is we serve it in our own house, while out in public, online, at work, etc
The way I read it, this is Excellent!!
True this instant judgement only applies to the parties involved, but we have (once again) an instance of a federal judge specifically opining that
SO Designators on IDs/DLs compel registrants to appear in public with a badge of past criminality (shame).
Proximity Laws are de facto banishment (punitive).
Travel Restrictions closely resemble Probation/Parole (de facto punishment).
The judge repeatedly cited Doe v Snyder.
I am no legal expert, and maybe I am misunderstanding this. But it sure looks like the wall is starting to slowly crumble.
So Tennessee will still be able to prevent this guy from getting off the sex offender registry because of the conviction for violating the unconstitutional registration law. Great.
We don’t know that.
The opinion says he still has to go through that process.
I wouldn’t hold your breath unless you really look good in blue…..
JoeM
He can apply to be removed and if he is denied he can either wait 2 more years and re apply since his violation charge was in 2017 or he can take it to the district court to challenge his conviction since he was charged under a law that was deemed unconstitutional
This is a win and a loss. A win for the Doe but afraid that will happen with our Ex post Facto case. The Does will win but judge will say only applies to them. I told my lawyer ( Back when I had the money ) to hold off so as not to mess up anyone else’s suit but now wish I had moved forward.
I think it is easier for the courts to let ONE person off the registry than to declare everyone is Free at last.
Even if that’s the case, it’s an invitation for similar ex post facto cases using this precedent.
^^Yes, chipping away at the registry as Ex Post Facto punishment. The more federal precedence, the better position when we file the final challenge with SCOTUS
So every one who donated to this florida ex post facto plus case won’t get relief, but just the people named in the laws suit? So why donate to some one else case? Please help me understand this I know if I am confused there must be others who have the same question!
It won’t be just named plaintiffs who benefit.
Correct.
Not being negative but there has not been a single win yet where the entire states ex offenders were removed from the registry. Even in cases like Michigan where they ruled it was unconstitutional, they have TWICE given the state extensions to fix the wording NOT to let anyone off.
A few individuals have been removed due to a challenge but the majority of us can barely pay for our day to day expenses, non the less a law suit against their state. One lawyer who was prepared to take my case just before I found out about F.A.C wanted $25,000.00 JUST in deposit money.
I told him I would look in my sock drawer, sure everyone has that laying around.
When you spend $25,000.00 on a car, you get a tangle item that comes with a guarantee. When you pay a lawyer, they tell you zero guarantees so you are basically playing lotto. Not to bash my first lawyer when I got arrest but, I paid him $30,000.00 plus another $5,000 non returnable bail money. All he got me was both me and himself yelled at by the judge.
I am not bitter, just beaten down, beaten up,gun shy, kicked around and very hard to trust anyone much anymore.
On a side note, I know the director of F.A.C wants it for all of us because if we all do not win, neither does her son so it is personally crucial for all of us to get a win. And we ALL are frustrated, just some hide it better than others. Some of us need to let it out on occasion.
The EPF plus lawsuit is challenging the law both ways; facially and as-applied. That is being done to give us a better chance of winning some type of relief. True, it would be better if the law is found unconstitutional on its face because the decision would apply to everyone in a similar situation. But that challenge is much more difficult to win. A ruling as-applied will still benefit everyone because it will set a positive precedent for future lawsuits. Any win is worth the money in my opinion.
It would be nice if this was in florida, in 1998 – 2002 it went from 5 years to 10 to 20 years
Where do you see that? It has never been 5, 10 or 20 years in Florida.
you are incorrect!!!
Ok – why don’t you show us if you know better?
At one time there was a way to petition for removal a certain number of years after conviction. There was never automatic removal, and some convictions were excluded. I think the waiting period was increased in subsequent revisions, probably before anyone had a chance to petition. Maybe that is what Tired Old Man is taking about?
Yes, I like to see the 5 and 10 years in print for fla. Statues too,please?
Wondering what you are talking about? If you are talking about the registry, it was for life, then a judge ruled there had to be a way off and it went down to 20 years you “Might” have a chance to get off. Then a new law raised it to 25 years with no guarantees.
Tell FAC to post what i put here to the reply instead if censoring it and not posting it!
Tired,
What you wrote IN NO WAY supported your allegation that Florida used to have a 5 year period of registration, 10 year period of registration and then 20 year period of registration, which is ENTIRELY FALSE. Rather than confuse our members and waste their time, if you are so certain you are right, why don’t you cite to the Year and Statute (including subsection) of the Florida statutes that support your argument?
If you’re so confident, I have a deal for you… If you’re right, I (not FAC, but myself personally, will pay you $500). If I’m right, you donate $500 to our legal fund.
How about that one?
Tired
I have had my share of comments not posted either. So I have no power to advise them to allow yours. I get really frustrated. Having said that, if we are fighting each other, we have failed already. Together we are strong, divided we fall.
I was told 20 years from the date you are released from lawful sentence. I fell in the early 90’s way before Megan, jessica Lungford, and adam walsh acts and got caught when it went retroactive
There has been discussions about this a few months age and The attorney Ron Kindle had spoken about this on the conference call If I recall right This was a few months ago when his office was bombard by this question
Beef
I did as well but a lawyer I was going to hire said otherwise and said it was changed and grandfathered in. He said you WON”T win on the 20 year thing, no judge will allow it. He said that if you are on the life registration you have to wait for the 25 years from sanctions to petition. My case is from 1991.
What pisses me off is the judge in Tennessee not having the guts / balls or whatever to rule it for everyone. I mean how can it be illegal for that ONE person in court but everyone else has to file their own lawsuits? Is that not the point of a class action lawsuit?
@ Cherokeejack The attorney I have in mind is Ron Kliner and he had argue and won ” You Can’t move the finished line”I have faith in GOD because I saw him open doors for me… and the attorney you spoke too did not have faith in himself.
When a person doubts,fears or becomes afraid of something they are already defeated
Just curious if there is any any other legal precedent for being able to petition for removal after 20 years instead of 25 for those convicted before the FL statutes changed?
Was Mr Kliners’ case just a one off court decision that he won, or is this the new standard?
Several Circuit have ruled this way.
Chris,
Pretend for a second, I am a judge. You come before me and you convince me with those rulings to petition at 20 instead of 25 years. I say ok fine let us hear your case.
Then I listen, say “Well mister Chris you brought up some logical points. However, due to the risk you still pose from your previous charges, I suggest you come back in 5 years. Motion denied.”
Not being negative, just be prepared because just because you CAN petition to get off, the law does not say the judge HAS to let you off. The ruling just says there has to be a way to eventually get off. Of course you can appeal. The judge who sentenced me 30 years ago is not an appeals judge so be my luck I would get her. NO way in Hell SHE is letting me off.
Cherokeejack
This case was not was not filed as a class action suite, it was filed in 2017 as an applied case. There are several cases in the federal court in the sixth district, including mine that need every ex post facto opinion they can get. This one was a win because at least he can see the end of this ahead of him, he no longer has a life sentence.
Cherokeejack, I am very interested in how you know what the Judge is going to say at that time? Really why are you sowing discord and robbing people’s faith? You Know the Bible says in proverbs 21 “The king heart is in the hand of LORD,as the rivers of water;he turneth it whithersoever he will” Maybe it wasn’t your time to get off but it could be Chris’ time. I don’t want you to feel you can’t post anything but your negative experiences don’t have anything with another’s outcome.
Think of Joseph in Genesis his brothers sold him, he was lied on, put in jail for 27 years he could have gotten revenge on those who did evil to him but kept his eyes on GOD. and told his brothers “what they meant for evil GOD meant it for good.” Chris trust in GOD timing
Sorry beef, Sorry Chris.
I was being a Debbie Downer for a moment and should have taken a breath and either written something else or nothing at all.
I accept your Brotherly correction and admonishment 🙁
I am going to take a time out for a week or so.