The following came from a Fox affiliate in Atlanta (https://www.fox5atlanta.com/)
MACON, Ga. – In a hearing that lasted more than three hours, a federal judge heard testimony and arguments Thursday in a lawsuit by sex offenders against a middle Georgia sheriff’s office.
“It’s a balancing test and that’s what makes this case so difficult,” said U.S. District Court Judge Marc Treadwell during the hearing.
On the one hand, Treadwell said, the government has a compelling interest in protecting children, but on the other, the sex offenders impacted are no longer in jail and have paid their debt to society.
Judge Treadwell gave both sides a deadline of 5 p.m. Friday to submit any additional documents or materials for his consideration.
He must not only decide whether to grant an injunction against the sheriff’s office to stop the posting of the flyers, but also whether to grant all the county’s sex offenders class-action status. That would mean his ruling would apply to not only the homes of the three plaintiffs but all 55 registered sex offenders in Butts County.
Mike
AND, for $30,000 there is zero guarantees offered by any lawyers other than injury lawyers who advertise “No recovery, no fee”. You can hire the best attorney on the planet and if the judge ain’t buying it, you are toast.
I got twice the time the prosecutor wanted because I ended up with a hanging judge.
I as well have been approached by numerous lawyers offering to get my case thrown out, get me off the registry etc. etc.
First I do not have the money and even if I did, the risks of losing AND losing 30 – to 50 thousand dollars and get nothing out of it would be life altering.
Hello, there’s another aspect that is a close second to compelled speech and thats is ” There has not been one single incident ever happen on Halloween to a child by a sex offender. The whole stranger danger.came from our government and the guy with his hat pulled low n wearing a trench coat with candy lurking behind a tree waiting for a child also came from our government. Here’s the information:
http://texasvoices.org/halloween-fiction-or-fact
New ruling on this (h/t: Guy Hamilton-Smith):
https://mitchellhamline.edu/sex-offense-litigation-policy/wp-content/uploads/sites/61/2019/10/2020-Summary-Judgment-Order.pdf
Per the constitution
The compelled speech doctrine sets out the principle that the government cannot force an individual or group to support certain expression. Thus, the First Amendment not only limits the government from punishing a person for his speech, it also prevents the government from punishing a person for refusing to articulate, advocate, or adhere to the government’s approved messages.
Again more and more of our rights are stripped away. Next we will have to walk around with sandwich boards that read “Sex offender”.
Also
Chief Justice John G. Roberts Jr. reiterated the essence of the compelled speech principle: “Some of this Court’s leading First Amendment precedents have established the principle that freedom of speech prohibits the government from telling people what they must say.
TY for the update Jacob.
Hello, from what I’ve looked up an found out there’s no law requiring registered sex offenders to have or put in there yard or in there window, and there’s no law requiring that you must comply to what ever the sherrif commands you to do unless its in the law books, so i don’t know why the judge has weigh it out, the sherrif put the signs there illegally period.
The problem with the laws is that they have such a broad way of determining who is a sex offender…. you driving away from any place to take a leak and if a cop sees you and he just might charge you for indecent exposure and if you are anywhere near homes with kids they could put you on the list. Some one that did nothing at all to kids can be on the list just depends on where you are and what happened…
What continues to bother me is that the judge did not issue a ‘temporary cease and desist order’ to the sheriff to remove the signs until judgement is rendered. So, the whole time this is going on, the registered plaintiffs have to have these signs in their yard to further humiliate them until Friday, long after halloween, even though there is no law stating that they have to be displayed. If he judges in favor of the sheriff, he will be basically giving the sheriff in Butts County a ‘Carte Blanche’ right to do whatever he wants, which could include signs year round by using the same premise as doing it on halloween, and chances are, other sheriffs in Georgia will follow suit.
The judge made his ruling on the FACTS,rather than letting emotions or bias come first. The law didn’t give the sheriff the right to put the signs out. He can try to interpret the law so it’ll support his actions but at the end of the day, he was out of line. What hasn’t been mentioned is that Sheriff Long is running for reelection & appearing tough on crime will help him get votes. If any of the 55 registrants are now eligible to vote in 2020 I suggest they be first in line to support another candidate who will enforce the law instead of trying to make it fit his agenda.
Why would a judge do that? No need for a cease & desist when there’s no law either way which means whom evers yard the sherrif put the signs in the offender can go out an yank the sign out of the yard and throw it away, no law prior to this requiring the signs be placed so the offender will not get in trouble if he pulled the sign out.
Here’s an idea: registrants who are not allowed to hand out candy to trick-or-treaters or otherwise prohibited from participating in Halloween-related activities should see about donating some Halloween candy to a local children’s hospital for kids who may not be able to participate themselves.
As for the lawsuit, I hope it is successful. These signs put people’s lives and property at risk and we should demand better of our public servants.
All this is a lifetime of punishment
[ANDY’S COMMENT HAS BEEN REMOVED]
nice comment, Andy.
Sickening you allow violent comments against us.
Here is your own damn policy.
Comment Policy
PLEASE READ: Comments not adhering to this policy will be removed.
Be patient. All comments are moderated before they are published. This takes time.
Stay on topic. We welcome all opinions and encourage free discussion.
Be respectful. Do not attack, abuse, or threaten.
I am done with this site. We are suppose to be able to come on here and discuss our struggles without being threatened by death
This was the last straw. You obviously saw the comment and replied with “Nice comment Andy “? as if you are encouraging him to shoot us. ????
That was sarcastic
Yet the comment is still here…..
Thank you JZ and all who agreed with me. I have put up several comments on our cause, never to see them appear, and yet a violation of policy with hate and violence is not only posted but commented on by FAC and allowed to stand.
Looks like it was taken down. I can understand the policy of allowing anyone with a view to comment in here, I have gotten into it before with a few people like the guy suggesting riding a bike nude, but I did not ask for that one to be taken down because it was just nonsense, not violence, a big difference.
I do not mind opposing views and they are welcomed as they start conversation and shows what we are up against. However, when people make direct threats on a group of people ie: registered citizens saying they should be shot and killed, who in their right mind would allow that?
There are people who come in here who are just family of a registered person and are somewhat apprehensive to start with then see something like that will make them take a second look at wanting to join into the conversation.
I see stories almost every week of a registered person being attacked , protests outside their homes or on a slow news day deciding to ruin their lives all over again by featuring them in a story while sitting in their driveway chasing their kids on the way to the school bus asking ” Do you know your daddy is a rapist?”
We have enough to worry about than having to come in here and worrying about being threatened. It is not like we are allowed to protect ourselves. We are sitting ducks. The best I have in my house that I am legally allowed to have in the house, is my Louisville Slugger.
I am sure that is not the last we will see of Andy, if that is even his / her real name.
I picked up on the sarcasm right away. Andy is a class act and definitely has no skeletons in his closet.
Sarcasm is difficult to perceive by many people even face to face. Printed sentences without some obvious tell are very difficult to know whether they are meant sarcastically or not. Admittedly, I never saw the original comment, so I might have missed something that would lead me to understand that was meant as sarcasm, but as it stands I thought it was a serious comment from the moderator. I think the person threatening to leave needs to relax a little and ask; where do we go that’s more helpful than this organization? It’s just too easy to find fault and forget that although the FAC Commentators answer might have been a momentary error in judgement, isn’t that why many of us are here and think we deserve a fair chance to be a valued part of society again? Thanks FAC for all the long hours and hard work you all do for the benefit of others!
Who don’t you instead delete the comment from loser “andy”? It contributes as much here as I’m sure the loser does to humanity.
It is free speech Because the on line troll did not mention a person name directly I agree with F.A.C. Andy has the right to post his comments here just like anyone else. Perhaps Andy is will be educated or not.
F.A.C should not be treated like a Safe space.
How can the public (Andy) gain insight if there is no dialog,I think you taking his comment too seriously. I am petty sure some of the comments you guys and gals cause others to disagree with you. But to delete Andy’s comment would let the on line keyboard warrior to post more hate toward us.
Once again I support F.A,C decision to answer his comment with Sarcastic reply.
It is an open dialog ……. Jesus himself didn’t get mad when they accused him of wrong doing ,spit on him and nailed him to the cross but Said Father forgive them for they know not what they do .
I am not saying not to defend yourself but look at Derek at Once Fallen, he has been threaten too,taken to court and lied upon and he still educates the same people who threaten him while it be on line trolls or public displays.
All – I think beefstew327 gets my point.
We used to have a vigilante troll called ‘Valigator’ who wrote some awful things about registrants, FAC and Gail. We let some of her comments through to afford our members the opportunity to challenge her misguided thinking and introduce facts and statistics into her ignorant one-sided conversations.
Not to beat a dead horse, but to my knowledge, none of our efforts ever swayed The Valigator’s [aka Valerie Parkhurst] ignorant, hate-filled vitriol. I’m sure she went to her grave with a heart filled with hate.
Although I respect the opinions of FAC and beefstew327, I agree with others, this is not the place for a new valigator, who obviously is not interested in becoming educated on the subjects we have to deal with, but rather seek an outlet to spew their hate.
The difference is that all of the registered people’s information is available on the Internet —he could carry out his threat
I think it is very sad to bully F.A.C to remove Andy’s comment!
I’ve never known any fire to go out by adding more gasoline.
Comments that threaten or promote violence are ‘bullying’ in its purest form.
‘Bullying’ is why many students and even adults choose suicide rather than to suffer the direct threats and hatred that some people in society promote because it is so damaging.
To allow threats, violence, etc. on this site, or any site for all that matters, is allowing the same hate-filled bullying and rhetoric that is causing others to take their own lives, to grow and thrive, and we don’t need that here.
David thank you for your reply… But everyone is forgetting the purpose which is to educate the uneducated. How can anyone say these are threats? There are people who hold different outlooks and beliefs in life. The same people who make comments like this might be looking to vent anger because something happen to them or not. I do not know. So according to certain people F.A.C. should censor comments because a few did not like what a Troll (Andy) had to say.So now we become like the uneducated and try to silence them. I hate to bust peoples’ bubbles.But I totally disagree this is the perfect place to have dialog. Each and everyone has a protection online It called a screen name. Instead of using your real names use a name where people can’t find you. I am sadden that a handful people took offense at this. This allows TROLLS out there to push your buttons.
Read our Weekly Update this week
This is not a place for Trolls no more than a coffee shop is for White Supremacists to hold a rally.
People go to a coffee shop to relax and drink coffee, not for some radical group to hold a meeting to disseminate their views, and you wouldn’t last very long there defending their demeanor as you would here.
The argument you are using is not a ‘one size fits all’.
Yes, there are people who hold different views and outlooks on life, and there are, unfortunately even for the radically minded, some places for those to be expressed.
This site is not one of them.
You should read the ‘About Us’ section.
There are plenty of other sites where Trolls can voice their violent, degrading, dehumanizing opinions, and it is even invited in some of those places. Here it is not.
A Troll goes to places like this and others to be what he/she is-a Troll-not to learn truth.
If you think you can make an impact by showing them the truth, then go out there into Troll territory where they are prolific and fester, but this site is not designed for Trolls, nor should it ever be.
This site is for educating the media, legislators, etc., not for people to pour out their hatred and anger upon us they have already predisposed in their heart to vent.
You can easily find plenty of that elsewhere, and I mean plenty!!!
I think THAT would be better time well spent than defending a Troll whose presence here is neither wanted or part of the scope and mission of this site to correct.
I hope I can shed some light here, All our names and Address all over the internet. I am not defending any trolls as David suggested. I just wanted to bring to all of your attention. Some of these comments are being base on “What if”. In others words, it is called the “Probability Game.”
Where is your Faith in God?, that certain people worry about being killed or beat up. I want to point to a verse in the Bible. Hebrews 9:27 ” And as it is appointed for men to die…”(KJV) If you walk out side or drive a car or being a victim of …………(whatever happen). That was your appointment with GOD. I am sorry to sound morbid but the truth is no matter what happens every person is going to face death. I like to thank those who made comments to my replies because we establish a dialog I also like to thank F.A.C for having me.
And yet it was ok for us to be bullied? Double standard. Turning people off from coming in here will cause this site to collapse on itself. Why don’t AA meetings let people who were hit by drunk drivers attend the meetings and tell everyone in there they should be shot ( oh not by name ). How long do you think any of those people WHO ARE SEEKING HELP will keep attending? I know this site is not meant as counseling but that is EXACTLY what is “WAS” for me.
I am leaving now even though taken down because of people like yourself who think the comment was ok. I am not easily bothered but it was a blessing when I found this site and forum, that was until I saw that it was not a place to share openly because the site has ” Held comments ” that are valuable that are never approved then hateful violent comments that are praised. Makes me wonder whose side all of you are on?
Together we stand, divided we fall.
God is amazing. I am sure that many of you have already realized this — He ensured that the county that was to have the sheriff persecute registrants with his Halloween signs was named Butts County, and the sheriff that wants to terrorize registrants in Volusia County was born to a couple where the last name was Chitwood. (By the way, I am not trying to stigmatize the name Butts. The county was named after a war veteran, Samuel Butts, and I have known some very nice people who have also had that same last name.)
About midnight last night Fox news did a story on this. They had two attorneys weigh in. In short they both said the Sheriff was wrong from a legal stand point. One attorney said that the complaint was trespass and the attorney thought this was a weak reason, but had plenty of other reason’s as to why this was wrong. Of course they sympathized with the reason behind it though, but kept to the legalize for the most part.
I’m a Registered Person (RP) and I believe I have a moral responsibility on Halloween to go out into public and disappear. I always do it.
This year I’ve decided that I might as well do it in Butts County. I’ve talked to some other RPs and they are going with me.
I considered contacting some RPs in Butts County and seeing if they wanted to hang out, but we decided not to. We should swing by these plaintiffs homes and take them some gifts. But more likely is that no one will know we are there.
This is what Registries get you. RPs on Halloween are not a danger. But people doing exactly what we will be doing, driving around neighborhoods and trick-or-treaters, are dangerous. Children are hit by cars every year. You would think this criminal regime would care about that and put signs in the yards of traffic violators.
Total fail by a self-serving, totalitarian, criminal sheriff.
POTUS gave a speech today in S. Carolina about criminal justice reform. He said he wants to take action, not just all talk ( like all previous admins.). He said he wants to return the rights to the citizens of this country and those convicted, and take it away from politicians. Because they don’t belong to politicians; these rights belong to the People.
https://youtu.be/rarMdp02rT0
I think this case is going to be surprise win. It’s no longer the rights of the Sheriff and the few. It’s for All. I think that’s why the judge is saying it’s a “hard” case, because she’s about to “disappoint” the mob mentality.
Sorry to burst your bubble but we heard the same rhetoric from the last administration then Obama went to sin IML. I can guarantee you if Congress passes a tough-on-sex-crime law, Trump will sign it. Whoever takes his place likely will, to.
The President is not our concern when it comes to these laws; Congress is our concern. They’re the ones we have to focus on to stop bad legislation.
Then we should hit them with the updated evidence based law which means there must be evidence for a law to be enacted plus the study our government did before regitry was passed wich shows recidivism at 9%
Of course we always hope for the best but prepare for the worst.
“It’s a balancing test and that’s what makes this case so difficult,” said U.S. District Court Judge Marc Treadwell during the hearing.
Not really judge. Actually the many Law Review articles, the body of research both private and academic which has been published over the years, not to mention some high profile court cases decided by your collegues make it pretty clear.
Is he really trying to make a decision without making sure he is well informed and educated about the issue?? Maybe judges in Georgia don’t read too good.
Judges are first and foremost attorneys and many of them are elected and many of them are appointed.
Some judges do not know the law very well and have to go read case law before a case or they just wing it and pass sentence based of emotion like happened in my case.
Some of them get removed after having many cases overturned due to bad rulings that were illegal.
Also remember, judges are not better than you and me and are just people. They put their socks and shoes on the same as us. Many of them have secrets of their own like the judge that was removed for using a sex toy under the bench during cases.
If judges were perfect, then why does the Supreme court rarely rule unanimously?
One judge can look at a case and say you have merit and another judge just dismisses your case. Then BOOM you take that case to an appeals or higher court and they overrule that judge. What does that tell you ? NONE of them have any idea what they are doing and are playing with people’s lives with the stroke of their mallet.
Just a few moments ago I sent the following email to the clerk of courts for the Hon. Judge Marc Treadwell. Her email is [email protected]
I attached the Halloween statement from ATSA.
They may not take me seriously, and may dismiss me as a crank (probably). But They may just read it, and who knows? Maybe I am entitled to enter evidence.
Here is what I sent:
“Hello:
I would respectfully like to ask to enter evidence as a friend of the court. I believe that this would be considered an amicus brief.
I am not a lawyer, and so I would ask the court’s indulgence in this non-standard format.
Nevertheless, I wish to respectfully assert my right (should it exist) to have a say in this matter and to introduce what I believe to be important evidence in this instant case.
The evidence is a statement of fact and findings from an internationally known group of psychological professionals who specialize in the treatment of Sexual Offenders. (It is attached to this email in pdf format.) This piece of evidence presents the scientific findings that there is no correlation between the Halloween holiday and sexual deviancy as it relates to the molestation of children. The connection is, in fact, a myth.
[The Association for the Treatment of Sexual Abusers is an international, multi-disciplinary organization dedicated to making society safer by preventing sexual abuse. ATSA promotes sound research, effective evidence-based practice, informed public policy, and collaborative community strategies that lead to the effective assessment, treatment, and management of individuals who have sexually abused or are at risk to abuse.
ATSA’s members include treatment providers, researchers and educators, victims’ rights advocates, law enforcement and court officials, and representatives of many other stakeholder groups. The core values that guide ATSA are professional excellence, community safety, collaboration, and advocacy. ATSA promotes the philosophy that empirically based assessment, practice, management, and policies enhance community safety, reduce sexual recidivism, protect victims and vulnerable populations, transform the lives of those caught in the web of sexual violence, and illuminate paths to prevent sexual abuse.]
Thank you, your honor.
Respectfully,
(My Full Name, Address and Phone)”
****In case anyone missed it, her is the statement from ATSA once again:
A statement from the Association for the Treatment of Sexual Abusers.
As October arrives and families begin preparing for Halloween, it is always a priority to ensure children’s safety during this holiday. It is important to learn the facts and know the risks to your child during this festive time. A heightened risk of being sexually abused is NOT one of the dangers children face at Halloween.
The simple fact is that there are no significant increases in sex crimes on or around Halloween. There is no “Halloween effect.” There is no change in the rate of sexual crimes by non-family members during Halloween. That was true both before and after communities enacted laws to restrict the activities of registrants during Halloween.
The crimes that do increase around Halloween are vandalism and property destruction, as well as theft, assault, and burglary. In addition, according to the Centers for Disease Control, children are four times more likely to be killed by a pedestrian/motor-vehicle accident on Halloween than on any other day of the year.
Fully 93% of sexual assaults on children are perpetrated by someone known to, and trusted by, the child and the child’s family. But due to the myths regarding child sexual abuse that focus on “stranger danger,” communities and lawmakers often endorse policies that do little to prevent sexual abuse and instead unnecessarily stretch limited law enforcement resources.
Jurisdictions that ban individuals on sex offender registries from participating in any Halloween activities, require registrants to post signs in their yards during Halloween, or round up registrants for the duration of trick-or-treating do not make children safer. Instead, these approaches create a false sense of safety while using law enforcement resources that could be better spent protecting children against the higher risk they do face during Halloween – injury or death from motor vehicles.
Child sexual abuse is a serious public health issue that faces all communities. Although the prevalence of child sexual abuse can be difficult to determine due to under-reporting, researchers estimate that one in four girls and one in six boys will be victims of sexual abuse before age 18.
For concerned parents, the best way to protect children from sexual abuse is to know the facts about sexual offending and take precautions based on facts, not fears. Parents can visit http://www.atsa.com to learn more about sexual abuse and prevention.
Let kids be kids. Having to explain the sign to a child is harmful to a child in of itself.
The Butts-hole sheriff admitted in a statement that the reoffence rate of registrants was incredibly low and that there were more imminent dangers to children. This should be a no brained for the judge as the sheriff admitted the danger is low/ non- existent.
Maybe he should stop alcohol sales a few days before and close bars on Halloween as that is a much higher danger to children and the community as a whole (I wanted to say “Butts-whole” LOL).
I see on PACER they uploaded more docs, with pics of where they were posting the signs and lot information. Hope they grant the class action for everyone else!!
Thanks Chris – this is a summary of what’s been filed:
Minute Entry for proceedings held before US DISTRICT JUDGE MARC THOMAS TREADWELL: Motion Hearing held on 10/24/2019 re [6] MOTION for Preliminary Injunction filed by COREY MCCLENDON, REGINALD HOLDEN, CHRISTOPHER REED (Court Reporter Tammy DiRocco.) Court Reporter: Tammy DiRocco.Time in Court: 2 hours/ 50 minutes. (Attachments: # (1) Court’s Exhibit List, # (2) Court’s Exhibit 1 10/21/19 Facebook Post – Re-elect Gary Long, Butts County Sheriff, # (3) Plaintiff’s Exhibit List, # (4) Plaintiff’s Exhibit 1 Notice to Registrants, # (5) Plaintiff’s Exhibit 2a Photo of sign in front of Plaintiff McClendon’s residence, # (6) Plaintiff’s Exhibit 2b Photo of sign in front of Plaintiff McClendon’s residence, # (7) Plaintiff Exhibit 2c Photo of sign in front of Plaintiff McClendon’s residence, # (8) Plaintiff Exhibit 3 10/27 /18 Facebook post – Butts County Sheriff’s Office, # (9) Plaintiff’s Exhibit 4 Butts County, GA Code of Ordinances, Sec. 101-502 – Development standards for streets, # (10) Defendant’s Exhibit List, # (11) Defendant’s Exhibit 1Warning Sign – Butts County Sheriff’s Office, # (12) Defendant’s Exhibit 2 Aerial view of Plaintiff Reed’s residence, # (13) Defendant’s Exhibit 3 Aerial view of Plaintiff Holden’s residence, # (14) Defendant’s Exhibit 4 Aerial view of Plaintiff McClendon’s residence, # (15) Defendant’s Exhibit 5 Warranty Deed – Lester Reed, # (16) Defendant’s Exhibit 6 Plat related to lot in Exhibit 5, # (17) Defendant’s Exhibit 6a Exhibit 6 with identifying marks (circles), # (18) Defendant’s Exhibit 7 Limited Warranty Deed – Reginald Holden, # (19) Defendant’s Exhibit 8 Plat related to lot in Exhibit 7, # (20) Defendant’s Exhibit 8a Exhibit 8 with identifying marks (circles), # (21) Defendant’s Exhibit 9 Warranty Deed – Willie and Linda Mcclendon, # (22) Defendant’s Exhibit 10Plat related to lot in Exhibit 9, # (23) Defendant’s Exhibit 10 a Exhibit 10 with identifying marks (circles)) (cma)
And I am assuming those lawyers are not working for free so the registered citizens had to spend their own money to fight for something that is obviously a violation of civil liberties in the first place. And not that it makes any difference but those no longer on probation at the very least should be exempt from signs.
Like I said, where I live we are not stopped from trick or treating if not on probation but I do not participate anyway.
What it does remind me of here is , that if I went to a shelter during the hurricanes, they would put me in a closed off space and there would be signs all over the place with my name and photo. I chose to stay home and risk death rather than humiliation, harassment and maybe harm ( Since we are not allowed to protect ourselves because we cannot even carry protection )
Don’t worry those nicely humans who is really trying to make a great big name for them own purpose is going to get what we’re going through on a daily basis with our lives and they will really feel how it is on what we’re going through may God help us all
The business of law enforcement has long since been that of the unscrupulous and corrupt. And for that my dear readers we should all be filled with fear and many prayers!
You can carry protection just not a gun, you can carry a bat or piece of pipe. Or legal size knife. Your allowed to have a sword in your house on your wall as decorations (wink wink) My probation officer told me that. The strange thing is in my case there’s no evidence whatsoever i got convicted when i got out i took my whole case to an out of town attorney he looked it over for a week and found no evidense counselor read my case he says im innocent my probation officer believes im innocent & the head councelor in the group meeting she said “there’s two here that are Innocent” she mentioned me and another person. But in order to get my case brought before the judge it’ll cost me $30,000 which i dont have. I know what your going through, my life is h*** and im innocent but i feel stuck