“When a vigilante does something like this and exposes somebody, you can’t use what they’ve gathered,” Kirshy said. “There’s no chain of custody, there’s no guarantee that what they have created — that being the video or the audio — is accurate.”
There’s no procedures or protocols being followed in civilian operations and therefore no way to establish who’s on the other end of the phone.
“The goal of law enforcement is not to get hits on an online video, it’s not to make money,” Kirshy said. “There’s no other goals there for law enforcement other than the enforcement of law and the punishment of people who deserve punishment.”
Chris Hansen jailed (fails to appear to explain withholding from defense):
https://apnews.com/article/arts-and-entertainment-8faadccd0ce1c7d10fcbe4480cecab8e
I bypassed the paywall. The rest of this article all but glorifies these pathetic thugs. It sickens me.
These comments have true thought to them and yes even michaels “hingsight” or the one about the underground railroad has meaning. Sure we can all look at situations differently. Sure I am white and I’m just as proud as the black man or the red man but when justice goes a miss than its time to speak up for truth. See pride and proud are to opposites.
One of my chaperones since my parents are deceased is part Cherokee and we happen to meet in VA were I live since I am from W,VA and she is also. Did not government treat the American Indian bad, what about many blacks. The point is this registry is vain and unjust in any American state in many ways. Even this penal system needs to be revamped or do you think they would send a sex offender to war from prison if war broke out.
Now Florida is unique. Yes I loved the spanards and the spanish colony history their. Florida has a good heritage but it was not always guns and roses so to speak. This registry is not always guns and roses or a walk in the park. either one speak up, stand up, as we all go around in life once and we all that are involved in this registry can make a difference to help true American Justice for all. Hay I’m not scared to write the President or the Governor and I even an debating on doing that over me getting my rights back.
CherokeeJack:
Batman (Adam West) died in 2017.
Actually
Adam West was not the original Batman.
Lewis Gilbert Wilson was an American actor, who was most famous for being the first actor to play DC Comics character Batman on screen in the 1943 film serial Batman.
Yes I cheated and Googled it, I didn’t even know that.
Big lie. Law enforcement stings are for publicity, keeping those federal grant dollars coming in, and proping up bad legislation, and giving society a false sense of security.
WC-Tn
Meanwhile in Gotham (Any town anywhere), while they are setting up fake stings, 1000’s of unsolved REAL crimes are being ignored and filed away due to police staffing shortages.
Batman, please come out of retirement.
CherokeeJack
Unfortunately there is more fictitious information coming out of the real world than there is out of Marvel novels.
DavidM
Ouch, Batman is DC not Marvel
I am not a huge Comics geek but if the wrong enthusiest saw that , they would have a stroke LOL
CherokeeJack
You think we could get someone to lobby for a Batman assault registry? After all that would accomplish more good than a sex offender registry which only harms children and innocent people. After all politicians fell for that fairytale.
Sorry about the mistake.
FAC this is a positive article in many ways. Here in VA one doesn’t have to wear a mask to enter any store as long as they have their “shot” The ironic thing is how do they know if one has their shot.
I was talking to someone that I knew from a few years ago and he told me they can’t take one to court without wearing a mask or even refuse one entrance to a store with this COJVID shot issue. So how does one know if you have had a shot or not? Is it an independant decision or a choice? Consider much of this registry That’s like invasion of mind in a court of law wouldn’t you all say who or bowing down to someone in much of this.
Most all of this is a miscarriage of Justice. Is one using the sword in vain or using the sword of Justice? I believe we are all still carnal by nature but pressing and inducing on another is another matter and just as unjust as a poke e man game of a death sentence.
I think what we need to do is figure out how to spread the word to those who are about to think they just got lucky or are curious and have zero experience with law enforcement.
Maybe a T.V. show or movie.
Maybe a P.S.A.
Those of us on the registry would either not be on those sites or know from our vast experience with law enforcement that if they’re sex talking with someone claiming to be a minor, it’s a cop.
So if they bust someone on the registry doing some stupid stuff like this then well? Maybe they need a break for a while. Just my opinion.
I knew guys in prison who got busted like this. Most of those guys needed an attitude check.
By this I mean the whole (No victim) crowd who cant seem to remember it was them who engaged in a conversation with someone they thought was a minor to do whatever.
I know I done wrong. I knew it when I did it and yet like a selfish dumbass I did it anyway. Having 13 1/2 years to A) Think over the harm I caused my victim.
B) Experience the harm that came to me.
C) Knowing the punishment/not punishment I will endure forever, has given me the hindsight that could have come in handy when my victim needed it most.
Or is just about arrest numbers and conviction rates?
The threat is real!
I’ve had civilians with an axe to grind follow me, investigate and hire PIs to harasss myself and others that I associate with.
They file complaints with tracking units and with zero investigation from police, I have been arrested for supposed registration violations.
The threat is very real.
Fact is the accused never have any contact with a minor in any sense.
This vigilantes’ own words even state that 99 percent of people who respond to his fake profile don’t fall for his trap. Dude is pretty desperate to trap that 1 percent, considering he’s had some that he’s spent a year on in his scheme.
And the news has been ramping up stories related to sex offenses. I have never seen this many ever. Probably 50 in last 30 days. Here is todays
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/crime/florida-airman-accused-of-raping-11-year-old-girl-met-her-on-dating-app-report/ar-AAKBzCw?ocid=msedgntp
Yeah and under Baddo’s term of service at https://badoo.com/en-us/terms/ , 1. If you are under the age of 18 then unfortunately you can’t use Badoo yet because it’s a meeting place for adults only.
Did the girl lied about her age. Nope “The father of the girl, who had set up the account…” did so knowing she was 11. Way to go father, you got your daughter raped.
If you think a father got his own 11-year-old raped, you probably read the article backwards.
‘when law enforcement arrests somebody…the goal is to make that person a sex offender.’
Best para. in the whole article.
I have written this author to inform her of the facts surrounding these police stings, hopefully I hear back from her.
Yes, there is a large kickback PER ARREST AND PER PROSECUTION on these stings. Anyone who still thinks otherwise has not done their journalistic research 🙁
Any reply?
Let’s not forget the whole look at all the arrested we made we need a bigger budget so we can get more arrested and keep you sheep…… Oops I mean people safe ! Or so greedy fudd can have his picture in the news again and can make another corn ball self serving sound bite
I would like to speak to these people. They are telling shameless, blatant lies! These people really need to be held accountable for their sick behaviors!
“We are not going to create predators.” REALLY?? Then why are they specifically targeting men on adult dating platforms who are seeking a casual encounter with other adults who go to these places for that?
“We’re out there looking for people that have shown an interest in talking or chatting with a child… but we’re not the ones out there trying to put a thought into somebody’s mind.” That is a blatant big fat lie!! Why are they looking for “child predators” in adult places??
That is exactly what is done in these sex sting operations. Yes, police are doing this. Now, they are threatened by their competition of others also running this scam. Police do it for money, to help their own careers, and to feed their own sick pleasures and egos. Vigilante groups do it for popularity and to feed their own egos and sick pleasures. They’re all doing the same thing. Police actually learned this scam from the vigilante groups, like Chris Hansen. They saw how easy it is to run this scam and get away with it, so, they’ve jumped on that bandwagon too. A lot of it has also come from the cult Operation Underground Railroad, who is now under criminal investigation.
These people are not real heroes. They are sick individuals. If they really believe that there are real minors seeking adult men for sex, on adult dating platforms the way police do it in these sex stings they conduct, they would be looking for those minors to remove them from that risk, getting them help, notifying their parents that their children are seeking adult men to hook up with, etc. There would be a great deal of public awareness about teens doing this. The websites and apps that have adult hook up platforms would be informed (by these so called heroes) of this problem and instructed to monitor for minors seeking sex with adults. These websites and apps would then be informing their users of this problem and instructing them on what to do if they come across a minor on there who is seeking a hook up with adults, etc. Notice how none of that has been done? You know why? Because these sex stings are not about protecting real children at all. If they were, that is exactly what they would be doing, instead of creating it all, the way they’ve been doing it.
Guess what? The law about ICAC very specifically states that it is ICAC task forces’ obligation and duty to bring public awareness about this, for prevention purposes. It’s also clearly stated in their standards. They are obviously not following the law and their standards.
Why are they keeping it a secret from the public that they believe there are real minors seeking sex from adults on adult dating platforms? Why are they doing absolutely nothing to help stop this?? Could it be because they know that this is not something that really happens in real life, and they know that they will sound absolutely ridiculous when they make this claim? Why else would they keep this a big secret?
Why wouldn’t anybody on an adult dating platform who comes across someone who is clearly seeking a hook up and offering casual sex to them, but claiming to be a minor, not be confused and curious about who this extremely rare human being is? Why wouldn’t they want to see it for themselves and want to find out why this person is doing this? Why not? Nobody had ever come across anything like this before, unless of course it’s police or one of these decoys playing out their own fantasies. This scam is set up to make it look like the men they are entrapping are the liars, when in reality the police and the decoys are the actual liars in all this. They are the ones lying to everybody about this.
What they are doing is clearly not a valid way to catch online child predators. It’s absolutely ridiculous and pathetic! These pretend minors are not being talked into sex. They are actively and very purposely seeking sex from adult men. There is no question about that. Why else would it be such a common practice for police to hide parts of these conversations, especially the part that begins the conversation on the apps? Why is it a common practice to hide this evidence?
Everything they have accused (in this article) these vigilante groups of doing is exactly what police are doing in these sex sting operations. There is overwhelming evidence of that. They are lying! How many more times do I need to say it? Take a good look into it all. There is so much they are lying about!
They just keep hiding behind, “We can’t expose our secrets of how we catch child predators.” They are so full of sh**!
Aon you are so right. My friends daughter was on a age appropriate site she was 12 she had some guy trying to talk to her at first he told her he was 13 they he started talking sexual to her trying to get her to send pics of herself then told her he was 18 when she told her dad he got on but didn’t tell the guy he started talking sexual right back the guy finally said he was 42 and wanted to meet her to have sex that’s when my friend turned his camera on so the guy could see him the dude freaked out and got off line in a hurry. If they were really trying to find adults trolling for kids they should be on kid sites not adults ones but we don’t hear about them doing that and finding someone to arrest
Police simply have no incentive to actually stop crime. Law enforcement (LE) and prosecutors get funding and promotions not for reducing crime, but for arrests and convictions. Child pornography (CP) is a case in point. Most who are involved in CP are not producers but consumers/viewers. Producers are probably a lost cause for deterrence efforts. They do it because they like it, they are selling porn or both. If they chose, LE could seriously reduce the harm done to children by consumers.
One of the common LE and prosecutorial memes regarding consumers is that they are participating in the “marketplace” for child porn which induces more abuse and production. With the internet, the marketplace metaphor falls apart because supply and demand are decoupled. Once a photo hits the internet, supply is effectively infinite and any relationship to the original seller is severed. Financial gain might be achieved from the initial sale, but internet transfers provide no further feedback. Transfers between consumers causes harm but does not stimulate further production.
I propose a tactic for LE that would have most consumers scrambling to delete CP, smash their flash drives and never again view CP. LE has become pretty adept at tracking those who consume CP, either via peer-to-peer networks, commercial websites or chat groups. LE knows who consumers are. Otherwise they could never get a search warrant.
If the object of the exercise is to reduce harm to children, LE could send a notice to consumers similar to the following.
“Dear Mr. Smith, this is FBI agent _______. We have gathered evidence that you are engaged in viewing child pornography. Indeed, we have sufficient evidence to obtain a search warrant right now. We may choose to do so and certainly will if we detect any further involvement on your part. An arrest, much less a conviction, will ruin your life. We are very good at finding forensic evidence, and even if pornography has been deleted from any media, we will find it. We suggest you purge your electronic devices, even to the point of physically destroying all media; and don’t go back to any internet sites where you might find child pornography. It is your choice, but you are on our hit list.”
I ask those readers with a CP conviction what YOU would have done after receiving such a notice. Even if there were some tenuous market feedback to producers, demand would dry up. From the LE perspective this has serious downsides. It would actually reduce crime and crime statistics, which would contract budgets and offer fewer promotion points. A secondary effect would be to shrink the size of sex offender registries which are also fertile ground for budget increases.
Actual crime and harm to children would plummet. That may be the stated goal, but it is not the LE objective.
Veritas.
Yes there is a financial gain for law enforcement in running these operations. Most of these operations are funded by a grant and and the officers who work them are usually paid on overtime.
There is also financial Gain for those making the stings by putting them on u tube or t.v when they get sponsors . None of this is done for safety reasons.