When tragedy strikes your family, do you call for other families to suffer?
That’s the apparent approach taken by survivors of a horrible mass murder. You see, the alleged murderer in this case had also been convicted of a sexual offense. The family has circulated a petition, with excerpts as follows:
“We’re asking that a person CONVICTED of a sex crime against a child serve life in prison without the possibility of parole. We ask that the probationary terms of those already released from prison for child sex offenses be reevaluated, and we ask for their probation terms to include monthly home visits…We are also asking that sex offenders convicted of crime(s) against children rights be taken to have their own children…if you ruin a child’s life you deserve NO CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHTS!”
“We are also asking that it be mandated that all city police stations and schools in Oklahoma have a board set up with all local sex offenders’ pictures and information on them and kept up to date. This is so important so we can help our local people, police, and school staff aware of offenders in our area because the man responsible for these horrendous murders, like other offenders, are able to manipulate people into believing false information…”
“We would like to name this law ‘The Knights Law’ in honor of our beautiful Knights whose lives were tragically taken from them.”
This woman’s ignorance is dangerous because she doesn’t see herself as the villain. Radicalized hate and vengeance has no place in Democracy.
David M:
The court records state that the victim was 16, but it’s unimportant whether she was 16 or 17.
Justin Webster was the one implying that the registry should be harsher. VOCAL’s stance is that the sex offender registry must be abolished.
VOCAL also supports the reintegration of people who commit sex crimes back into society and is participating in efforts to help these individuals when they are released from prison or homeless to reintegrate back into society.
If you have any questions concerning VOCAL’s stance on the sex offender registry and the reintegration of “sex offenders”, you can read about us and our efforts at vocalhome.blogspot.com or email us at [email protected].
Vocal
I reread the article in the Tulsa news. His original victim was 17. Yes it was rape and tied up. This type rape is not a crime of passion. But a crime of violence which should be handled differently which it was . He was 19 in 2003 and sentenced to 20 years. He served 16 years and 9 months being released in 2020. But while in prison was accused of passing porn to a 16 year old. But was released anyway.
His family and the victim was trying to get him put back in prison to finish his original term and possibly another 10 years or more for the porn charge.
Where were all the therapists and workers that should have been working with this broken individual to help him integrate back into a society that he had never been in. Being in prison his whole adult life.
Nobody has a right to say “ we didn’t see this coming “.
This was not the typical sex offender that marks the million on the registry. So to say let’s harden the registry for something that had nothing to do with the registry except to put one more spike in his coffin is to miss the point completely.
There are so many of these campaigns against registrants that many of these proposed laws are starting to have the same name. Australia already beat them to the name “Knight’s law” in honor of Samantha Knight who was killed by a sex offender in Australia.
They call it Knight’s law in reference to the local mascot. Not only do they lack common sense, but they lack originality as well.
Things are gonna get a lot worse for us, you watch,, every aspect of our dilemma, everything from new laws to civil commitment. Its already starting in Oklahoma.(((((((((‘Knight’s Law’))))))))))) The sex offender frenzy is gonna get a tad worse for us,, God help us,, nobody else can.
It is called the quiet before the storm. Whenever they think we are complacent, they stir things up and catch us off guard. Case in point what almost passed with the license plates and driver’s licenses. What’s next, tracking devices implanted under our skin.
Why can’t a judge just open their heart and do the right thing? I know a few have done just that, but most of them are not in Florida. I won’t mention any politics since I gave up on politicians once the registry came out.
google husband kills family
sadly this is not unheard of
but sex offender is in the narrative now and the government will exploit this.
https://www.cincinnati.com/story/news/nation/2023/05/03/bodies-found-in-oklahoma-details-live-updates/70178102007/
Even Ivy father who daughter was murder “ “The sexual (offender) registry doesn’t work,” he said. “I think there needs to be action taken. There needs to be repercussions, and someone needs to be held accountable. They let a monster out. They did this.”
Even he knows the system is broke.
Eugene V. Debs:
Justin Webster, Ivy’s father is one of the one’s front and center pushing for this so called Knight’s law. He’s trying to make a broken system be even more broken.
I believe that when he was saying that the sex offender registry doesn’t work, he meant that the registry was not severe enough.
He also has a gofundmepage set up. It would be interesting to know if he is cashing in on this tragedy.
Yes I know I was just making a point to show that he thinks the registry is useless, which it is. Same as living red It stops nobody from committing evil which happen here. But what is aggravating is there was no sexual motives for these killings but yet registrants will pay again for some else who will never again walk the streets. Every time they pass a law it’s always the worst case examples they magnify and it affects everyone who committed a sexual offense so frustrating.
Also it seems like the police just botch this from the beginning. https://www.newsnationnow.com/crime/search-warrants-oklahoma-killings-jesse-mcfadden-errors/
@Eugene
And sadly, most of those laws are retroactively applied to us. My Ulcers now have their own ulcers.
Considering the registry is supposed to be the politicians iron clad “Preventative” measure that ensures the public trust for these type of incidents (if they’re going to use the prior sex offense aspect), then the s.o. registry, already being an evisceration of The Bill of Rights for every registrant, has once again been proven to be holistically obtrusive, useless, and an ineffective entity at its designed intent and has actually incited the very criminal acts its ordained to prevent (if they’re going to use the prior sex offense aspect).
So because of this one person’s actions, let’s forget completely about any good or exemplary actions plenty of other people who have been convicted of a sex offense have contributed to society. Not too long ago there was a man in Oregon who was killed in a mass shooting of a grocery store, but before he was killed, he was able to save the lives of other people in the store. After people went digging around about him, they found his criminal history and actuallly questioned if his actions should be considered heroic! This case is a juxtaposition, but begs the same question… Are all humans always and forever defined by one publicly acknowledged mistake or “heroic” action? Guess what world, humans are complex and everevolving and changing beings. Not everything a person does is directly related to any or every other thing they do. People are not linear beings. The current talking points of the majority of the populous is consistent with propaganda machines like NCMEC, the Book politicians, the Walsh’s, etc. It’s propaganda hype similar to the propaganda of marijuana and crack cocaine.
Do law makers ever cross reference the constitution before they banish, harm and punish people for life? How long do judges keep up the persona that the registry is not punishment? Especially because of it, several have been murdered because of its existence.
Correcting parenting in the USA will make safer communities for children & families. The Oklahoma case is a perfect example to set presidency and case law. If most of the sex crimes are first timers & people are known and trusted;
ITS BAD PARENTING!
(https://twitter.com/UFO_28Mansions/status/1658367192436465664?t=3rZk5W-PBnxNttHV51xAvg&s=19)
Every case is different and every circumstance is different. The forced registration list and the lives of the registrant’s family have become just a TOY for these politicians to use for their own political benefits.
I agree with everything stated above cus our children are most important.
What part of the above do you agree with specifically?
MR Dorsett I agree that children need to be protected
so lets have an AR15 REGISTRY, YES. How about 1000FT GUN FREE ZONE AROUND SCHOOLS. ANYONE WITH HIGH POWERED RIFLES CANT LIVE WITHIN 1000FT OF SCHOOLS LIBRARYS OR DAYCARES. YES
The point is, there is no other crime that has a registry, with the exception of the murder registry. Having said that, I challenge you to find it. I spend an hour of research and could not find any public murder registry.
Where is the vandal registry, repeat shoplifter registry, carjacking registry? And what about other groups who go rouge like a bad politician registry, dishonest judges, bad cops?
I bet there would be so much push back that they would demand it be ended or never even stop. Hypocritical to the nth degree.
CherokeeJack:
Indiana has a violent offender + sex offender registry all rolled up into one. Several other states have a violent offender registry. I believe Illinois is one of them.
We have to stop them before every American is on a registry.
Also, legislation has been proposed in at least two states to microchip sex offenders (Texas and Nebraska) and the calls to microchip sex offenders has been steadily growing over the last ten years.
This BS must be stopped. Sex offenders are the canary in the cage and unless Americans wake up, they will be microchipped as well.
[Note: The moderator is aware of no such bill to microchip registrants but would urge anyone with knowledge of such bills to alert Texas Voices and Nebraskans Unafraid so that their members can work with the legislature during this legislative session ].
Vocal
They can microchip me over my dead body. That is the mark of the beast as far as I am concerned. Bad enough to wear an ankle monitor (Which I never had to do thank God).
Although I do not believe in registries, it is one thing for people who commit sex crimes now and had knowledge of the registry. However, when my incident happened in 1991, there was no talk of a registry. When I was released in 1997, surprise, they had a lifetime gift for me that keeps on giving, I didn’t want it and you cannot send it back, refuse or return it.
Moderator:
VOCAL has been following these issues for decades, long before FAC, ACSOL, etc. and even the internet existed. These bills [citations needed] were introduced in both Texas and Nebraska several years ago before Texas Voices and Nebraskans Unafraid existed [moderator’s note: Texas Voices was established in 2008]. Wisconsin introduced a bill [citation needed] banning people from being microchipped against their will with one sole exception and I believe you can guess that exception (for sex offenders). You can google and locate all of these bills [moderator’s note: claim lacks supporting evidence].
I assume they were all in church Sunday asking God to cancel John 3:16.
https://twitter.com/UFO_28Mansions/status/1657887022596382725?t=8JTwUlyQWsrfK6aCqo9hDw&s=19☝️☝️☝️
Stay informed, stay educated, understand the reality of false fear! 💯🇺🇸💯
UNCONSTITUTIONAL;
PETITIONING TO CHANGE LAWS IN PLACE FOR ISOLATED INCIDENT AGAINST THE STATISTICS OF ODDS OF ALL SEX CRIMES OVER THE COMPLETE AMOUNT OF ALL CRIMES COMMITTED IN THE USA WOULD NOT FIT IN ALREADY LAWS IN PLACE. PRISON DOES CHANGE SOCIETIES ISSUES!!!ITS MISINFORMATION, LACK OF PARENT TO CHD EDUCATION, HATE CRIMES, FALSE FEAR, AND MISUNDERSTANDING OF MENTAL HEALTH THAT IS NOT BEING RECOGNIZED.
👉These crimes are less that .0025 percent chance of happening out of all crimes. For how this crime was committed is far more rare due to it circumstances and details. Consequencing the roughly one million people on the registry or future registrants would not be realistic, ethical, or in the path to positive change in society.
Yes, it is vary sad what has happened, there were things in that community that could of prevented it. Mostly, it is a parenting issue, and not teaching children how to be safe and prevent harm to them selves. This is not a national consequence from a extremely rare event. This petition holds no merit and will be striken down.
We are truly sorry this tragedy happened but this case does not hold merit to change the laws being guided to the future to have less hate, better community safety knowledge, no registries, less guns, happier prosperous people, ect.
#ABOLISHTHESEXOFFENDERREGISTRY
💯👉NO ALTERNATIVE TO THE REGISTRY EITHER! 👈💯
Or maybe re-write John 3:16 KV from “For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.” to something that replaces the he/him, Son with something that is more inclusive… such as “For God so loved and loves all of Creation that offered was one sign to show all who exist they will not perish at the end of their life journey, but have everlasting existence into the next.”
Hmmm, after reading that, I can see where it might be offensive, maybe judgy, definitely all inclusive, probably unneeded. but I bet it will help get me votes and support… Yes, let’s make this a permanent change AND if you happen to have been involved in the previous iteration, well you are just wrong and need to get to accepting the update….
I hope everyone can see my sarcasm in this comment… if you didn’t see my sarcasm … it is Change for change’s sake is never good or useful, Change that has a name attached to it is often just emotional and is often not good or useful, and Change that is made to further one’s political agenda is NEVER good or useful.
As with most issues surrounding crimes involving SOs, this is a pure knee jerk reaction. We live in OK and we have managed to find a decent amount of peace and live a relatively normal life here. I knew the minute I heard about the case that we were in for trouble even though my husbands case is 23 years ago.
This is a horrific crime but questions need to be asked. The family let their children go for a whole weekend with people they had never met. They didn’t meet them or know what their children were doing. This man was mentally disturbed (whether caused by registration or not) but the family is lashing out and trying to make the loss of their children have meaning. The problem is that they will cause many other innocent children untold hell in their pursuit of “saving them.”
Interesting history of crime ,violence, victimization and lack of learning from it to the degree of perpetuation.. 1) illegally use scarlet letter registrys to force a young adult on to a sex offender registry for a relatively minor consensual offence and continually turning torture screws until they snap and commit a murder.basicly force them to commit a serious crime.. 2) instead of doing the rational thing and taking a degree of responsibility, admitting publicly torturing people until they go crazy and murder or harm others is a bad idea let’s decide to play John Walsh and ask how many more tortures can be those ght of and of course get money and fame for?..can we turn screws and create more crime and victims as a memory for the deceased?.(everyone does understand this isn’t about any one caring for the memories of the deceased. This is nothing but a greedy attention and money grab…John Walsh style… ..
If you read the full article about all the details of this murder, which it was ,and there is never any excuse for that . The victims didn’t deserve what happened to them but the circumstances around the incident need to be looked at. When he was 21 he had a relationship sexual, with a 17 year old. Of that I don’t have all the details, so he was put on the sex offender registry. He tried to get past it and get a better education in prison. After release he tried to make a go of it but then it all fell apart because of the registry. Couldn’t get a job and someone was accusing him of things that would have put him back in prison. He snapped , saw no way out and unfortunately he and others suffered because of a broken system and and an unstable mind.
To add more breaks to a system already broken is the definition of total insanity. All who signed this petition are only setting themselves up to be responsible for more failures in the future.
People don’t behave logically when they seek “attention”( this isn’t about children who died,this about greed and what can I get from it the living)..John Walsh 2.0…How can I become famous and wealthy of the death of my child?. You are correct. If there was any logic people would realize the registry is what caused this crime in the first place..keep destroying lives and wonder why they snap…go figure..I’m sure a politician will get the wrong messege from this and expand the stupidity.
I am not trying to sound weird but a 21 year old with a 17 year old in many states is Romeo and Juliet law isn’t it? Not like a 30 year old with a 14 year old.
A 21 year old with a 16 year old here in Michigan is legal [but generally not recommended. – moderator]
I was not implying it was ok, I was just saying the laws differ so much from state to state that in one state you can date someone within a few years of your age and others you are imprisoned. The “United” states are anything but united when it comes to laws. At one time, in one state you could drink at 19 and another you had to wait until you were 21.
So in one state someone has an underage girlfriend and they get a pass, but in another state their life is ruined forever was my point. Same with the registry, in some places you can get removed in others, good luck with that.
I completely understand where you’re coming from Jack; and you’re right about the various age laws. I know there’s states where the age of consent is 18, yet many place it at 16. Hawaii and Missouri have a minimum age to marry placed at 14, though its with parental consent. Now I don’t advocate getting married that young, but why can a parent give permission for their daughter to get married at age 14, but cannot give permission for her to have sex at age 14? It makes no sense and seems like a double standard. Obviously I don’t advocate for a parent to give a minor permission to have sex at age 14, but I think you see what I mean. I remember years ago a girl I knew who was emancipated and married at age 15 to a 32 year old guy. I never understood how a 15 year old can show the court she’s responsible enough to be on her own, but not responsible enough to consent to sex.
He didn’t have a “relationship” with his 16 year old victim. According to court records he tied her up and raped her.
The victim, Kristle Strong is now appearing all over saying that he should have gotten life for the attack. As everyone here know, fewer than 20% of all people convicted of sex crimes go on to reoffend.
Pathological offenders make up, perhaps, about 2% to about 5% of all of persons who commit sex crimes. The other 95% to 98% will pay for his actions.
Well if that is true, that is even more disturbing. Even though any relationship with someone underage is bad, when done with violence or force makes it even more concerning.
Having said that, some judges sentence people who had a “Consensual” underage relationship with the same sentence as someone who raped or even killed someone. And to add to that, in Florida it is a life sentence on the registry anyway.
Well that’s pretty horrifying.
To be honest; I don’t think Oklahoma can afford the type of reform these grief-stricken individuals are asking for. It sounds about as preposterous as when there was(I forget the case/country) a kidnap victim was [email protected] a multitude of times whilst the abductor was watching legal pornography. Upon her release she and her family started a movement to end all legal porn. It got a surprising amount of votes and eventually fizzled out. I wouldn’t be worried about it. This would have suit after suit and has interstate/federal law double jeopardy written all over it.
Gotta love all their pitchfork, witch hunt, burn them at the stake comments on their petition. This alone shows just one state’s, hatred for us. Vigilantism against us isn’t hard to show evidence, when comments like these, are plastered everywhere on the internet. I guess they like the idea of stripping even minor’s on the registry of their rights, and having them on death row, or simply executed. What about simple child abuse cases? Guess same for them. Human beings are so pathetic!
Would the recommendations in the petition prevent the senseless act by a mentally unstable individual? Probably not! I did not read anything indicating the cause being his sex offender status. The are hundreds of mass shootings each year in the United States. Being a sex offender has not been the cause of any mass shootings.
Taking the actions prescribed in the petition would not have prevented the immediate event nor would such actions prevent the next mass shooting. The actual cause of a mass shooting needs to be fixed not an emotional grasp at a person status as a sex offender.
That’s absolutely right. The next mass shooting will happen in days and it most likely will not have anything to do with sexual crime. And just like with all of the others, this one too will be soon forgotten and replaced with more horror to fill the evening news.
But, …..but, is there a mass shooter registry?
right??? lol
Yes and theyre probably going to try to augment capital punishment/the death penalty as they did here in Florida. Plus homicide and sexual assault/sexual battery are different felony categories altogether.
Is a response from FAC warranted?
Gail Commented, she is the founder of FAC.
This is BS, if you take “all” constitutional rights away from an individual by constitutional law they are considered “stateless” meaning this individual can be held in a jail cell indefinitely If i read the article correctly he murdered somebody he did not commit another sex crime therefore he would be guilty of murder and not a sex crime and my understanding of the Constitution an American citizen cannot be wiped of all of their constitutional rights.
Just because they are sex offender and then they murdered somebody does not mean that that a government can take all of their constitutional rights away this is clearly an infringement on the Constitution of the United States. Thay feel that because this individual was a sex offender and then he murdered somebody that they believe this individual belongs in the jail cell essentially they would have to convict him of the murders and then give him either a death penalty or sentence him for Natural Life in person but by constitutional law no law enforcement and/or government can remove all guaranteed constitutional rights from an individual.
3392 out of 5000 people signed their petition. Change.org doesn’t let non-signers comment, else I’d wonder if a larger number would tell them how spiteful it is. And I’m SAF not gonna sign something that advocates the harming of others, even as a supposed tit-for-tat.
I cannot see this passing the Supreme courts test. Punishing a family member for something you did? Do we live in a middle eastern country that chops off someone’s hand if they steal?
So, if they are going to do this, then it’s only fair that this then also be done to those who have falsely accused someone of this, and this should also apply to all of those people (police and prosecutors) responsible for the wrongful conviction they created. Their behavior is even worse because they’ve caused so much harm to even more lives, the innocent men who were falsely accused and convicted and their families. Those responsible for that should be held accountable their recklessness and the great harm they’ve done. By doing this they have proven they are a real risk and danger to others and are likely to do it again. So, why not apply this to them? After all, those police officers and prosecutors who have forced wrongful convictions have more victims with harm done to more people than those convicted a real sex crime.
Why not just apply this where it’s most needed? Do it to those with the most victims who have caused the most harm. Do it to those who falsely accuse and convict innocent people of serious crimes.
Judgey hypocrites take every opportunity to harm others. They’re caught up in the harm for harm cycle. They think it’s biblical, but the “eye for an eye” thing has nothing to do with what most people have been misled to beLIEve. They say they beLIEve in God but don’t beLIEve when “God” says “Vengeance is MINE.” They think it’s their right. Hypocrites all of them.
You KNOW there’s a political move behind that petition. These people are too ignorant to see that being murdered had nothing to do with the sex offense. Would they have asked that all rights be removed if there was no “SO” involved? Even here in Florida murderers can still vote.
[Moderated].
And here, yet again, they’ve initiated more fighting between us instead of us uniting against THEM. I’m gonna search for evidence that they very purposely chose someone with the “SO” situation to kill two birds with a single stone. Everything they do is calculated to the last dot. We’re stuck in hell till every human wakes up.
Many of these people who go after others, themselves have scary hidden secrets themselves, that if got out they would hide in shame.
There is a story in the Bible about that, when the people were going to stone a women for sinning. Jesus looked all of them in the eye and said, “He who has not sinned, throw the first stone”. Each of them dropped their stones, bowed their heads in shame and slowly walked away.
So I say, anyone who is perfect, please, raise your hand.
BTW I am not talking about the guy murdering people, I am talking about us doing our time and moving on, but not being able to live in peace with our families so we are punished and shamed for life, along with anyone who lives with us.
This is disgusting!!
He didn’t kill these people because he was a sex offender he killed them because he was deeply disturbed. Let’s not conflate issues!
You’re right and this is an emotional response to an incomprehensible tragedy and loss, but I would ask them if they would want to suffer this same treatment themselves and point out Matthew 7:12. If we all get what we deserve for our sins instead of or conversions and His mercy then nobody is gonna be saved and of course with human beings…there is almost never any justice.
Sirach 2:[18] Let us fall into the hands of the Lord, but not into the hands of men; for as his majesty is,
so also is his mercy.
Sirach 8:[5] Do not reproach a man who is turning away from sin; remember that we all deserve punishment.
I agree Gail!! The Registry failed this child….